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    • CommentAuthorEnemyToo
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007
    I didn't see an official thread for one of my favourite composers, let the discussion begin!

    Here's a youtube video of the Passion of the Christ (one of my favorite scores of all time) Symphony I found.

    http://youtube.com/watch?v=ddkehvUToys
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      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007
    That is simply amazing for sure, his best work to date along with the original score for the Passion of Christ. In fact i can't decide between the two but overall i think i am inclining towards the latter.
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
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      CommentAuthorMarselus
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007
    EnemyToo wrote
    I didn't see an official thread for one of my favourite composers, let the discussion begin!



    Aahhhh, Demetris, you´ll find someday the greatness of "Lair". It´s a matter of time, just have to look for the right path, go to the light, etc.. biggrin

    I do think the Passion Symphony is his best work to date, although I think it can´t be judged along with the rest of his work. With the Symphony he had TOTAL creative freedom, he wasn´t bounded to the images of the film or the director´s orders / suggestions.
    Anyway, no doubt The Passion (both original score and the Symphony) will be a/ THE highlight of his career.
    Anything with an orchestra or with a choir....at some point will reach you
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      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007
    LAIR better than Passion? Yeah, that's a cool new joke alright! shocked biggrin wink
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
    •  
      CommentAuthorMarselus
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007
    Christodoulides wrote
    LAIR better than Passion? Yeah, that's a cool new joke alright! shocked biggrin wink


    Mmm..."Lair" and "Passion" (the symphony) are in different leagues, IMO. "Lair" and "Passion" (score) are in the scores league (and here I´m afraid it´s a matter of taste: I couldn´t decide which one is better, it would depend on the day / mood).

    And "Passion Symphony" is impressive anyday, and one of the most touching compositions I´ve ever heard.
    Anything with an orchestra or with a choir....at some point will reach you
    • CommentAuthorEnemyToo
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007
    My top 5 Debney scores would be:

    1. The Passion of the Christ (score and symphony), he seems to have put to much heart into that score and also made it very personal.

    2. Cutthroat Island- a masterpiece

    3. Lair- one of the most energetic and thematically rich scores I have ever heard

    4. Dragonfly- very emotional

    5. The Princess Diaries
    • CommentAuthorPanthera
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007
    John Debney is one of my favorite composers. I think White Fang II was the first score of his that I heard and now I am a big fan.
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      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007
    I am glad we're all agreeing his PASSION Works are the most touching and passionate works he has ever done. Pure genius if you ask me, especially the score.
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
    •  
      CommentAuthorMarselus
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007 edited
    EnemyToo wrote
    My top 5 Debney scores would be:

    1. The Passion of the Christ (score and symphony), he seems to have put to much heart into that score and also made it very personal.

    2. Cutthroat Island- a masterpiece

    3. Lair- one of the most energetic and thematically rich scores I have ever heard

    4. Dragonfly- very emotional

    5. The Princess Diaries


    Almost 100% agree with you. I´d change "The Princess Diaries" for "Hocus Pocus" but my top 4 is exactly as yours.

    Christodoulides wrote
    I am glad we're all agreeing his PASSION Works are the most touching and passionate works he has ever done. Pure genius if you ask me, especially the score.


    I think we all agree here. His Passion Works, as you say, are / will be the most passionate works of his career.
    Anything with an orchestra or with a choir....at some point will reach you
    • CommentAuthorEnemyToo
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007 edited
    I'm not sure if any one has heard this, but I also recently discovered his bits of his score (from youtube) to The Halloween Tree (1993), an animated made-for-tv movie.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s1EIp_MfqTI

    I also find it interesting that he receives credit right after Ray Bradbury and before the director/producer
    •  
      CommentAuthorErik Woods
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007
    Marselus wrote
    EnemyToo wrote
    My top 5 Debney scores would be:

    1. The Passion of the Christ (score and symphony), he seems to have put to much heart into that score and also made it very personal.

    2. Cutthroat Island- a masterpiece

    3. Lair- one of the most energetic and thematically rich scores I have ever heard

    4. Dragonfly- very emotional

    5. The Princess Diaries


    Almost 100% agree with you. I´d change "The Princess Diaries" for "Hocus Pocus" but my top 4 is exactly as yours.


    I'm with ya, Marselus. However, Passion and CutThroat would switch positions. CutThroat is his masterpiece and one of the greatest scores ever composed!!!

    -Erik-
    host and producer of CINEMATIC SOUND RADIO | www.cinematicsound.net | www.facebook.com/cinematicsound | I HAVE TINNITUS!
    • CommentAuthorEnemyToo
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007
    Marselus wrote
    EnemyToo wrote
    My top 5 Debney scores would be:

    1. The Passion of the Christ (score and symphony), he seems to have put to much heart into that score and also made it very personal.

    2. Cutthroat Island- a masterpiece

    3. Lair- one of the most energetic and thematically rich scores I have ever heard

    4. Dragonfly- very emotional

    5. The Princess Diaries


    Almost 100% agree with you. I´d change "The Princess Diaries" for "Hocus Pocus" but my top 4 is exactly as yours.

    Christodoulides wrote
    I am glad we're all agreeing his PASSION Works are the most touching and passionate works he has ever done. Pure genius if you ask me, especially the score.


    I think we all agree here. His Passion Works, as you say, are / will be the most passionate works of his career.


    AH, I forgot about Hocus Pocus b/c of it's promo only release I haven't heard much of it. The only thing I know is that it's so darn expensive to find that promo on ebay, ect.

    The Passion is pure genius, but some people don't recognize that. It seems as though, from some of the reviews/comments I read some people tend to not give Debney enough credit because they say he was very influenced by Peter Gabriel's Last Temptation of Christ. While listening to both pieces, one can agree they have similar sounds, use similar instruments, but Debney actually composed themes, and approached it with much more complexity and it shows, his work is far superior.
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      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007
    Actually, although they share some characteristics, the approaches to PASSION OF THE CHRIST and THE LAST TEMPTATION OF CHRIST are totally different and so are the compositional styles of the 2 composers, and their background. No relation.
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
    •  
      CommentAuthorMarselus
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007
    Erik Woods wrote

    I'm with ya, Marselus. However, Passion and CutThroat would switch positions. CutThroat is his masterpiece and one of the greatest scores ever composed!!!

    -Erik-


    I also think "CutThroat Island" is his masterpiece, no doubt about it, but he put so much passion in both "The Passion score" and "The Passion Symphony" (sorry for the pun) that both scores can switch positions perfectly. Anyway, both are in the top 2.

    EnemyToo wrote
    AH, I forgot about Hocus Pocus b/c of it's promo only release I haven't heard much of it.


    "Hocus Pocus" was the first score by Debney that I listened, and was highly impressed.

    EnemyToo wrote
    While listening to both pieces, one can agree they have similar sounds, use similar instruments, but Debney actually composed themes, and approached it with much more complexity and it shows, his work is far superior.


    Exactly, that´s what makes it such a passionate and touching work.
    Anything with an orchestra or with a choir....at some point will reach you
    • CommentAuthorEnemyToo
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007
    Christodoulides wrote
    Actually, although they share some characteristics, the approaches to PASSION OF THE CHRIST and THE LAST TEMPTATION OF CHRIST are totally different and so are the compositional styles of the 2 composers, and their background. No relation.


    I COMPLETELY agree with you! That's the way I feel about both scores (with the Passion being far superior). It just seems as though some people can't see that and it's frustrating! They hear those similar characteristics and scream PLAGIARISM! RIP-OFF!!! And they couldn't be more wrong!
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      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007 edited
    EnemyToo wrote
    It just seems as though some people can't see that and it's frustrating! They hear those similar characteristics and scream PLAGIARISM! RIP-OFF!!! And they couldn't be more wrong!


    Well, welcome to the film music world my friend, full of wonderful, truly great people and well.....idiots. They can't see because they don't want to see. There are SO many reasons why the 2 scores are of totally different musical approach and philosophy and that a duduk or a middle-eastern percussion won't in fact make 2 musical works the same at all that it's truly silly to actually try to sit down with them and explain those dead-obvious things. Plus the afore-mentioned background of the 2 composers which is of no relation. But i guess if some people like to bash they'll also find reasons to do so. Have you ever wondered if the fact of the bashing with that of the score being so DAMN successful is indeed irrelevant? I think not. Same goes for the 2 scores they accuse of plagiarism; would they think of and direct link to Gabriel's THE LAST TEMPTATION OF CHRIST if the subject matter and the movies' common controversial character weren't the same? I think not again.
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
    •  
      CommentAuthorErik Woods
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007
    EnemyToo wrote
    Christodoulides wrote
    Actually, although they share some characteristics, the approaches to PASSION OF THE CHRIST and THE LAST TEMPTATION OF CHRIST are totally different and so are the compositional styles of the 2 composers, and their background. No relation.


    I COMPLETELY agree with you! That's the way I feel about both scores (with the Passion being far superior). It just seems as though some people can't see that and it's frustrating! They hear those similar characteristics and scream PLAGIARISM! RIP-OFF!!! And they couldn't be more wrong!


    Well, it's not just TEMPTATION that he is ripping off... but what would a Debney score be without some lifts here and there. wink But that aside... I still think it's an extraordinary work and the symphony is absolutely incredible!

    -Erik-
    host and producer of CINEMATIC SOUND RADIO | www.cinematicsound.net | www.facebook.com/cinematicsound | I HAVE TINNITUS!
    • CommentAuthorEnemyToo
    • CommentTimeDec 3rd 2007
    Review of Debney's Lair from ifmagazine:

    http://www.ifmagazine.com/review.asp?article=2153
    • CommentAuthorEnemyToo
    • CommentTimeDec 3rd 2007 edited
    Erik Woods wrote
    EnemyToo wrote
    Christodoulides wrote
    Actually, although they share some characteristics, the approaches to PASSION OF THE CHRIST and THE LAST TEMPTATION OF CHRIST are totally different and so are the compositional styles of the 2 composers, and their background. No relation.


    I COMPLETELY agree with you! That's the way I feel about both scores (with the Passion being far superior). It just seems as though some people can't see that and it's frustrating! They hear those similar characteristics ascream PLAGIARISM! RIP-OFF!!! And they couldn't be more wrong!


    Well, it's not just TEMPTATION that he is ripping off... but what would a Debney score be without some lifts here and there. wink But that aside... I still think it's an extraordinary work and the symphony is absolutely incredible!

    -Erik-


    What would most (if not all) composer's scores be without occasional lifts here and there? wink When's the last time anyone heard a wholly original score without any prior influence or inspiration (especially in this temp track filled age of film scoring)?
  1. Two new comedy (what else) projects for Debney according to GSA:

    Swing Vote: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1027862/

    Bachelor No. 2: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1046163/
    •  
      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeDec 5th 2007 edited
    Scorefanatic wrote
    Two new comedy (what else) projects for Debney


    rolleyes
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
    •  
      CommentAuthorSirCaledor
    • CommentTimeDec 5th 2007
    Scorefanatic wrote
    Two new comedy (what else) projects for Debney according to GSA:

    Swing Vote: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1027862/

    Bachelor No. 2: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1046163/


    I listen to these wondeful epic scores of Debney (CutThroat Island a true masterpiece) and then I see how he always gets to do comedies...it deeply saddens me.
    • CommentAuthorAnthony
    • CommentTimeDec 5th 2007
    So what's the best typical-Debney-comedy score? My vote goes to The Emperor's New Groove. spin
    •  
      CommentAuthorErik Woods
    • CommentTimeDec 5th 2007
    EnemyToo wrote
    What would most (if not all) composer's scores be without occasional lifts here and there? wink When's the last time anyone heard a wholly original score without any prior influence or inspiration (especially in this temp track filled age of film scoring)?


    Tired argument. sleep

    Yes, but at least other composers try to hide it by doing something creative. Debney just... rips it off. wink

    -Erik-
    host and producer of CINEMATIC SOUND RADIO | www.cinematicsound.net | www.facebook.com/cinematicsound | I HAVE TINNITUS!
    •  
      CommentAuthorErik Woods
    • CommentTimeDec 5th 2007
    Anthony wrote
    So what's the best typical-Debney-comedy score? My vote goes to The Emperor's New Groove. spin


    Bruce Almighty. Liar Liar. Lost and Found. Generic scores oozing saccharine... enough to make me puke! vomit

    The Emperor's New Groove... I never considered that a comedy score per se. It's follows more the typical animated film formula... a lot of difference styles rolled up in one.

    -Erik-
    host and producer of CINEMATIC SOUND RADIO | www.cinematicsound.net | www.facebook.com/cinematicsound | I HAVE TINNITUS!
    • CommentAuthorEnemyToo
    • CommentTimeDec 6th 2007
    Scorefanatic wrote
    Two new comedy (what else) projects for Debney according to GSA:

    Swing Vote: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1027862/

    Bachelor No. 2: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1046163/


    He should've gotten IRON MAN!!! ARGGHH
    •  
      CommentAuthorMarselus
    • CommentTimeDec 6th 2007
    EnemyToo wrote

    He should've gotten IRON MAN!!! ARGGHH


    Agree. He could have delivered something great. Sadly, we´ll never know.

    As for me, he can do hundreds of silly comedies if in return he composes a classic from time to time (CutThroat, The Passion, The Passion Symphony, Lair).
    Anything with an orchestra or with a choir....at some point will reach you
    • CommentAuthorPanthera
    • CommentTimeDec 6th 2007
    I was curious about that. How involved was he with the Passion Symphony? Did he compose the whole thing using the themes and ideas from the movie? Or did someone else do it based on his ideas?
    •  
      CommentAuthorErik Woods
    • CommentTimeDec 6th 2007
    Panthera wrote
    I was curious about that. How involved was he with the Passion Symphony? Did he compose the whole thing using the themes and ideas from the movie? Or did someone else do it based on his ideas?


    Pretty sure the symphony is all Debney.

    -Erik-
    host and producer of CINEMATIC SOUND RADIO | www.cinematicsound.net | www.facebook.com/cinematicsound | I HAVE TINNITUS!
    • CommentAuthorMatt C
    • CommentTimeDec 6th 2007
    I dearly wish Lair would get a CD release. I know iTunes and music downloads in general is the in-thing now (and way cheaper for record companies to make more albums readily available), but I still like having music on a physical medium if I can help it. Heck, a limited release would be greatly appreciated. (Not to mention I didn't start buying from MSM until they started releasing CDs.)

    Perhaps mikael could get the rights from Sony to issue the score out on MovieScore Media... hint hint. wink Even a Varese, Intrada or LaLa Land release would be appreciated.
    http://unsungfilmscores.blogspot.com/ -- My film/TV/game score review blog