Humanists of the world gather up!

I just wonder about the whole money thing

Agreed.

Might be, you'll start with kicking your dog and 10 years later kill your neighbour too.

I know exactly what you mean, it's a real dichotomy.

As for the afternoon, what can i say? I love that passionate youngster, even if that's in a strange way, but still! (make sure you watch the entire video heh)

Here is one for you humanists to grapple with. Dante Stallworth, a receiver for the football Pittsburgh Steelers killed a pedestrian while under the influence. He got 25 days in jail. Lawyers rule

25 days is a joke, sorry

He should get few years, indeed. Maybe he's a kind of celebrity?

I searched for this topic again because I wanted to post about an interesting interview I saw on TV, but then I read the whole previous discussion first. It is somewhat related to eachother.

I watched an interview with Trudy Dehue who is a Dutch psychologist and philosopher of science. She wrote a book 'The depression-epidemic'. She wanted to research how the meaning of depression has changed and how / why so many people are depressed these days (or called depressed, by a doctor or by themselves). She is only analyzing the problem and not judging other peoples depression. It is more about the meaning and label of depression. While doing research she came across the role of pharmaceutical industry and antidepressants and a part of her book is about that too. She is hoping there will be independent research of medication instead of research funded by the pharma industry. I thought the interview was very interesting, especially the parts about what the norm is in western society these days and why people who do not fit that norm are easily called depressive.

She also talked a bit about homosexuality because it is a label too, like depression, made by society. There were times when homosexuality was so completely accepted it wasn't even mentioned, just like we don't mention our hair colour these days. But society changed and had other expectations and that's how the label of homosexuality became such a big deal. Very interesting. In this show the interviewed guest always brings favorite clips, videos and songs. She also chose the scene from a movie (don't remember) with Al Pacino where he says 'I'm not gay, I just fuck men'. She thought that was a good example of how to explain the effect of categorisation, just like with homosexuality.

Anyway, I thought that fitted the discussion before, but I just wanted to say it was a very interesting interview and I'd like to read the book, which is about depression and medication (and easy access to heavy medication). They even showed commercials for anti-depressants from the 50's. Unbelievable the different way of looking at it back then...

For Dutchies, it will be aired again this saturday afternoon, so if you're interested in the hype of depression (or so it seems), anti-depressants and changing norms in society:
http://www.vpro.nl/programma/zomergaste … /42152366/

I know Trudy's work and she is a lot more balanced than the interview suggests (basically all she really says is "don't take too many anti-depressants too quickly, and more research is a good idea", which I wholeheartedly concur with.

That said, I am a HUGE believer in biopsychology.
Depression always has a physical side (whether it be at the neuroreceptor side, or natural dopamine or serotonin). Why on earth wouldn't anyone want to tackle that side together with the actual trauma that has caused depression?

It's been proven time and again that the most successful (in terms of time and effect efficiency) treament is not "either...or...", but a combination of therapy and medication. Bully for science.

As to the prevalence of depression in the last century, I tend to agree with much she says.
There is a a clear trend towards fashionable man. No longer are we doomed to walk in our father's footsteps as we were in the middle ages. We have choices, options and possibilities. And expectations we need to rise up to. Bars we and society set ourselves. And more often than not it's the gaping hole between expectations, speed and societal norms and standards that leads some who cannot -for whatever reason- keep up or compete or find a focus into depression.

Nothing new there.
But four hundred years ago, those who couldn't keep up were simply left behind.
Or talked to a priest.
Or rejoiced in the fact that at least they'd get a reward in the afterlife.

The psychologist has now taken the role of the priest.
And the other two options simply aren't valid in this society any more.

Yes, there's more depression in the west since a hundred and fifty years.
It's unavoidable.
We will just have to accept it, and deal with it as best as we could.

Conversely a famous gay Dutch writer once exclaimed: "I'm into men. Not fags!"

I completely agree with everything you say.
(Sorry. That wasn't a particularly helpful or insightful post on my part. )

Labels, doesn't the society love them? It's such an easy thing to put things into stereotypes and label people. And even if, what is worse HAVING a label, or being unable to fit in any of them?

I have a friend in Hawaii. She's half-Japanese, half-white. And because of the "half" part she is rejected by BOTH white and Japanese (which is the biggest minority in Hawaii) communities. What the hell is that about? Reminds me of the mischling concept. Or not really?

What was the reaction to that?