Making your own perfect album

Yeah, and most people believe in an invisible friend that talks to them and occasionally answers their prayers!

Absolutely not! In fact, BEMOANING is the only thing we have left!

Stop it! MORE ANGER; PLEASE!!!!

Are you talking to me?

Since I'm God around here, I'll have to say that I stand with the 50% of Thor's side on this. Who's by accident, named after a God as well.

I disagree with that. The artistry you're actually describing is the music for the film itself, not an album presentation. And of course there's artistry involved in film composition, i.e. writing music specifically for film. If you don't do anything with that music when you transfer the music to an audio-only format, however, there is no artistry involved. It's merely a technical transfer. Lots of craft in that, but no subjectivity or art other than inside the tracks themselves.

What we're talking about here is the artform of ORGANIZATION and ADAPTATION of musical raw material, not the artform of creating music itself.

I agree that the creation of the music itself is THE thing, but soundtracks is in the unique position wherein the music swaps medium from one where it is supposed to support the visual action to one where it is supposed to stand alone as a self-sufficient piece. As such, adaptation and re-organization becomes a very important artistic criterion for it to work (at least for me). Two different media, two different set of properties.

If I want to experience the artform of film music composition, I'll watch the movie.

I agree with this and I think in a lot of cases a C&C presentation holds up as just that without losing any of the 'artistry'. I'm not against album programs, I'm just argumenting against C&C having zero artistry which I find an extreme position. I'll agree that in the cases it doesn't hold up, an album version is recommended.



Problem is the movie has sound effects and dialogue, and isolated scores are scarce. So to enjoy the music fully, a C&C presentation helps. And the audio medium isn't limited to a certain running time, when again, the music is up to the standard. The album form for soundtracks in its roots, is an archaic ruin depending more on avoiding orchestra fees and prepping fast releases (album releases that are done while the music isn't finished yet) than it is a true art form...

I didn't say it is the same, nor did I say that the album presentation has no artistry, but I like to have the choice of both options. With a strict album presentation, I don't get that choice and OFTEN (not always) it makes me miss out on a lot more artistry than is featured.

I think we're talking past each other on this point. I agree that the actual CONTENTS of the music entails artistry and creativity (duh!) and those contents are obviously also in a C&C presentation. Inside the tracks themselves. But what we're talking about here is on a structural level; how the cues are organized, not the musical contents per se. I don't think it's extreme to assert that a C&C PRESENTATION/TRANSFER has little to no subjectivity involved. It's basically just taking all the cues from the film and putting them on CD. No thought as relates to musical structure away from the movie. To put it it 'on the edge', it's basically a mouse click operation, using the film as the guide for how you sequence the tracks.



That is a perfectly legitimate way to approach soundtracks, although I don't share it. If I want to experience the music that way, I'll watch the film (even if it means it's dialed down or drowned in sound effects now and then -- that's part of its purpose, after all). It's part of the film TOOLS, and the only way I can appreciate that is in the film itself. That being said, sometimes I think it's useful with an isolated score to really hear what the composer wants to communicate IN THE MOVIE.



I think any technical limitations or external factors there might be, these may also prove valuable point-of-departures for an artistic statement. If re-use fees demand that you only have 30-40 minutes at your disposal and the score runs, let's say, 80 minutes, it means it 'forces' the composer or the producer to re-think the material, structurally. So in that way, it may actually be an opportunity, not a hindrance.

It's exciting because it goes to the very CORE of why we're soundtrack fans. It's such a unique 'genre' (if you could call it that) that has two very different ways of approach. Your interest in soundtracks can either stem from the movie experience or it can -- like in my way -- appear as an extension of interest in other types of 'concept albums' (prog rock, instrumental electronic music, classical). As such, it's easy to take things personally (which often happens at FSM), even though it shouldn't, really. It's just a matter of personal preference, backed up by one's own rationalisations of that preference.

I think that's the reason for why it is -- and has always been -- my favourite topic in film score land.

Perhaps I'm not understanding you, but those two options don't seem mutually exclusive to me nor the only options available. I wouldn't apply either to myself. My interest in soundtracks stems from me simply enjoying the music; I will headbang to The ecstacy of gold, no matter how it works in the movie (or even if it had never appeared in a movie), and no matter how it's presented in an album.




Indeed, and that's one reason why I find it a bit silly. If the whole thing essentially boils down to "I prefer the colour blue" vs. "I prefer the colour red", I'd rather go and look at the colour that does it for me, than making a big deal out of trying to "prove" that my colour is the best one.

Peter

OK, I think now is a good time to ask what C&C is. What's C&C?

Isn't what "modern crap, sorry "art" is all about ?

Oh and where did you people grow up? In a hole? "C&c" Is "command and conquer"

Yes.