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      CommentAuthorRalph Kruhm
    • CommentTimeDec 6th 2007 edited
    Christodoulides wrote
    Ironing session? shocked biggrin biggrin

    I knew it...

    We´re one of those 1 in 1000 families where the guy stayed at home raising the child while the wife continued to work on her career after some time. My wife´s office is only ten minutes away, while I had to drive two to three hours AND earned less than her when the time came to make a decision. It was as simple as that. Beyond that, nothing was simple, of course, since originally, I had other plans wink so I knew nothing about cooking and cleaning and washing and ironing and stuff. But years of practice did help.

    -----
    Secretary of Ironing
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      CommentAuthorErik Woods
    • CommentTimeDec 6th 2007
    Ralph. I'm impressed. Thank you very much for that detailed account of your listening session. And I can totally see where you are coming from and what you like and don't like. I'm still shocked though that "The Chase" cue didn't do it for you... but after reading your comments on "The Arena" it's all starting to make sense. However, I still think that "The Chase" is just as coherent and memorable as "The Arena" and some of Williams' previous Star Wars work... but just in that new millennium John Williams style which unfortunately has turned you off and so many other Williams fans. But you know.. you say that the cue is too chaotic. Well, I would have it no other way due to the scene it was composed for. Just love how Williams throws the main motif around to the percussion and then to the orchestra and then back to the percussion, etc, etc. Oh how I would love to hear this piece in its entirely for the scene that it was composed for. No editing, no looping, nothing... I want to see the cut Williams got when he composed this piece with the music in it. I'm sure it would absolutely blow our minds. Damn you George Lucas and Ben Burtt!!!

    -Erik-
    host and producer of CINEMATIC SOUND RADIO | www.cinematicsound.net | www.facebook.com/cinematicsound | I HAVE TINNITUS!
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      CommentAuthorRalph Kruhm
    • CommentTimeDec 6th 2007 edited
    Well, I can totally hear how Williams threw that rhythm idea around between instruments, and yes, of course you need composing skills on a very high level to be able to do that (*bows to the maestro*), and I can understand why you think that this kind of chaos is perfect for that scene. The style matches to what is happening on screen, and I will even go so far and say that it works in that context. But that doesn´t help me liking the sound of it. Sometimes I can adjust to it, if I can connect the music to specific action, but "The Chase" is just too much for me. Though I see why it was done the way it was, it is not the kind of music I like to listen to beyond film. Of course this doesn´t make it a bad score, just a very difficult listening experience I don´t enjoy.
    -----
    Secretary of Order
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      CommentAuthorErik Woods
    • CommentTimeDec 6th 2007
    Ralph Kruhm wrote
    Of course this doesn´t make it a bad score, just a very difficult listening experience I don´t enjoy.


    Well, it is a bad score. LOL. There are only hand full of cues that I like... but the awful middle sections of the score are filled with just terriblel, light, fluffy, romantic music that makes me want to puke. But then again, Williams was given such a bad film to work on.

    Anyway, I understand where you are coming from. You don't like... can't win them all. At least you can appreciate it for what it is.

    -Erik-
    host and producer of CINEMATIC SOUND RADIO | www.cinematicsound.net | www.facebook.com/cinematicsound | I HAVE TINNITUS!
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      CommentAuthorNautilus
    • CommentTimeDec 6th 2007
    Erik Woods wrote
    Nautilus wrote
    So...Is williams the best action composer? is it Goldsmith?? crazy


    Does it matter?

    -Erik-


    Nah!I was just being the Old Jordi.
    • CommentAuthortjguitar
    • CommentTimeDec 6th 2007
    I like the cues Erik mentioned well enough, I just don't seem to listen to the prequels very often. I think it'd be content with a "Best of Prequels" disc, because many of those tracks I can do without, especialyl in AotC. RotS is a pretty good listen if I'm remembering correctly, but it's been a while.


    Regardless, If I ever have an inkling to listen to Star Wars music, I tend to listen to the original trilogy, and from that, I tend to listen to the Empire Strikes Back. Or the various concert suites. THe prequels just don't get a lot of play. Maybe they should. That chase cue is awesome.
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      CommentAuthorNautilus
    • CommentTimeDec 10th 2007
    I have the Jaws 25 aniversary realease...But it sound too old!!!

    What about Mcneely re-recording???
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      CommentAuthorErik Woods
    • CommentTimeDec 10th 2007
    Nautilus wrote
    I have the Jaws 25 aniversary realease...But it sound too old!!!

    What about Mcneely re-recording???


    If you like a more concert hall sound. IMHO, I still prefer the original release which was a re-recording conducted by John Williams. A perfect album!

    http://www.amazon.com/Jaws-Original-Mot … amp;sr=1-2

    -Erik-
    host and producer of CINEMATIC SOUND RADIO | www.cinematicsound.net | www.facebook.com/cinematicsound | I HAVE TINNITUS!
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      CommentAuthorMartijn
    • CommentTimeDec 10th 2007
    Agreed.
    The McNeely rerecording is quite worthwhile and offers a lot of high-quality music.
    But at the end of the day for pure personal preference I'll go back to the version Erik refered to.
    And indeed, much of the reason is that the McNeely recording does have a far more concert hall sound, while the Williams recording is way more intimate (whic is a hard thing to do with an orchestra, come to think of it).
    'no passion nor excitement here, despite all the notes and musicians' ~ Falkirkbairn
  1. Erik Woods wrote
    Nautilus wrote
    I have the Jaws 25 aniversary realease...But it sound too old!!!

    What about Mcneely re-recording???


    If you like a more concert hall sound. IMHO, I still prefer the original release which was a re-recording conducted by John Williams. A perfect album!

    http://www.amazon.com/Jaws-Original-Mot … amp;sr=1-2

    -Erik-

    Agreed, Erik.

    I was brought up with this MCA re-recording of Jaws and it was so different and - ultimately - a disappointing listen as I had become so use to the re-recording. Now though both have their merits and I sometimes listen to one over the other and vis versa.
    The views expressed in this post are entirely my own and do not reflect the opinions of maintitles.net, or for that matter, anyone else. http://www.racksandtags.com/falkirkbairn
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      CommentAuthorSouthall
    • CommentTimeDec 11th 2007
    Erik Woods wrote
    Nautilus wrote
    I have the Jaws 25 aniversary realease...But it sound too old!!!

    What about Mcneely re-recording???


    If you like a more concert hall sound. IMHO, I still prefer the original release which was a re-recording conducted by John Williams. A perfect album!

    http://www.amazon.com/Jaws-Original-Mot … amp;sr=1-2

    -Erik-


    Agreed... but if only it had better sound!
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      CommentAuthorErik Woods
    • CommentTimeDec 11th 2007
    New video of John Williams conducting his 2002 Oscar suite for "Movie Rocks" that aired on December 7th.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JnJR5SBmli0

    -Erik-
    host and producer of CINEMATIC SOUND RADIO | www.cinematicsound.net | www.facebook.com/cinematicsound | I HAVE TINNITUS!
  2. Only noticed this post of Erik's today. Actually I agree with his points on all but one of these pieces, but thought I'd get my opinion in anyway!

    Erik Woods wrote
    "Bounty Hunter's Hot Pursuit" - IMHO one of the worst action cues ever composed by Williams. No sense of directions, random bursts from the brass, woodwinds, with swirling strings, etc. Why the hell was this scene even scored. The music added nothing!!! ARGH!


    Is this the cue that starts up halfway through the asteroid field scene, or the one that plays as Jango Fett escapes the water planet? I don't think the film needed an action cue in the latter scene if that's the one you mean.

    "Anderton's Great Escape" - Steven is going to kill me for this because it's one his very favorite action cues but this one comes out of left field. It doesn't fit the tone of the score... Williams composed two other action cues for this film that fit much better... but this swashbuckling "Ludlow's Demise" rip off cue was totally out of place. By itself it's a fun cue but wrong for the tone of the picture and score. Just imagine something like this exploding on the screen during Munich.


    I'm kind of partial to this one. I see what you mean about it standing out from the rest of the score - and I think the opening chase scene music is a pretty good template for what this film could have been. However I must protest in Williams' favour - the scene stands out from the rest of this pretty disjointed film like a sore thumb. It has more of those silly Spielberg jokes per 10 seconds than any other part of the film, and is basically an excuse (an incredibly well-blocked and edited one) to get people excited for five minutes. Musically, 'Anderton's Great Escape' was an excellent response to the tone of one scene in an otherwise inconsistent film* - had he approached it in the more modernistic style of the other action scenes, people probably wouldn't have laughed when Spielberg wanted them too. That is, if they did laugh!

    Mind you, I can't argue with what you say about him doing the same cue a few years before in THE LOST WORLD. Perhaps think of it this way - if 'Anderton's Great Escape' hadn't so popular, it wouldn't have ended up in the temp track of ARSENE LUPIN, and become one of Debbie Wiseman's better action cues. wink

    * Whenever I listen to the score or watch the film, I find the soft string music at the end such a cop-out - Spielberg trying his best to close things off in a pat fashion, but it just isn't convincing. Ann Lively's haunting vocals should have been the last thing heard in the score.

    "The Moon Rising" another out of place cue. A.I. is a brilliant score but this one cue almost destroyed it for me. What a mess.


    Do you mean the electronic bit?
    Looking back on the score, I see what you mean though. I like the album arrangement of the cue, but had the piece been more in his terrifying WAR OF THE WORLDS mode, it probably would have made the scene more impressive. (It's hard to be scared of motorbikers in hyper-colour suits tearing robots apart without the most intimidating music.)

    "Tavington's Trap" I'm action not a fan of most of the action material from this score but this fast paced cue for a slow motion scene was just wrong and laughable. Williams really needed to tone it down for this one.


    That's funny, because that was the one bit of scoring in THE PATRIOT that I really felt worked. Most other people would have scored it in slow motion (say like Horner's car chase music from A BEAUTIFUL MIND), but Williams wrote one of the best fast-paced string-based action cues he's done in years.
    A butterfly thinks therefore I am
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      CommentAuthorSteven
    • CommentTimeDec 11th 2007 edited
    I wonder if the writers of Ratatouille based Anton Ego's character on Michael? biggrin

    http://www.imdb.com/character/ch0009859/photogallery-1

    Good LORD!
  3. My mummy did make such delicious ratatouille...
    lick
    A butterfly thinks therefore I am
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      CommentAuthorNautilus
    • CommentTimeDec 15th 2007
    What about this??

    http://www.amazon.com/Music-Star-Wars-A … mp;sr=1-11

    Wich is the 7th and 8th cd? The other cd's contains the liner notes from RCA's edition?

    thanks.
    • CommentAuthortjguitar
    • CommentTimeDec 15th 2007
    No they don't have the liner's and the 7th disc is corellian edition, I believe the 8th is a cd rom with images.
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      CommentAuthorNautilus
    • CommentTimeDec 16th 2007
    tjguitar wrote
    No they don't have the liner's and the 7th disc is corellian edition, I believe the 8th is a cd rom with images.


    Thanks. So there is not any Pack with the whole 2 cd's trilogy with the liner notes? the liner notes are only in the 2 cd's single sets from 1997?
    • CommentAuthorTimmer
    • CommentTimeDec 16th 2007
    Antineutrino wrote
    New from Prometheus: Images

    http://www.screenarchives.com/title_detail.cfm?ID=8306


    Wow! shocked

    And no discussion?
    On Friday I ate a lot of dust and appeared orange near the end of the day ~ Bregt
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      CommentAuthorErik Woods
    • CommentTimeDec 16th 2007
    Timmer wrote
    Antineutrino wrote
    New from Prometheus: Images

    http://www.screenarchives.com/title_detail.cfm?ID=8306


    Wow! shocked

    And no discussion?


    For those that say that John Williams NEVER experimented with his music obviously HAVEN'T heard this score.

    -Erik-
    host and producer of CINEMATIC SOUND RADIO | www.cinematicsound.net | www.facebook.com/cinematicsound | I HAVE TINNITUS!
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      CommentAuthorMartijn
    • CommentTimeDec 16th 2007
    That last comment probably measn it's another write-off for me?
    I'm really not in the mood for another experiment... sad
    'no passion nor excitement here, despite all the notes and musicians' ~ Falkirkbairn
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      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeDec 16th 2007
    Me neither.
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
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      CommentAuthorMartijn
    • CommentTimeDec 16th 2007
    Yep. Just listened to the sound clips.
    NOT for me.

    <sighs deeply and puts on Jane Eyre> sad
    'no passion nor excitement here, despite all the notes and musicians' ~ Falkirkbairn
  4. I'd no idea what Images would be like when I saw it advertised - or when I pre-ordered it! But I've just heard the clips over at SAE. I'm not sure if I'm seeing more than there actually is in the music but there seems to be a lot contained in these few clips that echo other (later?) scores.

    "In Search of Unicorns", in places, reminds me very much of John Carpenter's suspense music from something like The Fog. "Dogs, Ponies and Old Ruins" is a lovely piece.

    "The Love Montage" is very Goldsmithian to my ears (with a bit of Kamen's The Dead Zone).

    I'm really looking forward to hearing this in full. Maybe it won't be a CD to play for a quiet night in - unless it drives everyone else out of the house - definitely a side of Williams I've not associated with him before.
    The views expressed in this post are entirely my own and do not reflect the opinions of maintitles.net, or for that matter, anyone else. http://www.racksandtags.com/falkirkbairn
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      CommentAuthorNautilus
    • CommentTimeDec 17th 2007
    Oh....

    After listen empire strikes back a lot, and Return of the jedi....It's true what a lot of people said.

    Return is less focused and more irregular than Empire.

    Sorry , Martijn shame
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      CommentAuthorSteven
    • CommentTimeDec 17th 2007
    Martijn wrote
    Yep. Just listened to the sound clips.
    NOT for me.

    <sighs deeply and puts on Jane Eyre> sad


    Ne neither, sounds horrible.
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      CommentAuthorAndy
    • CommentTimeDec 19th 2007
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      CommentAuthorThor
    • CommentTimeDec 22nd 2007
    The IMAGES score is fantastic! I've had it as an LP-to-CD transfer for years, and it's arguably Williams' most avantgardistic work - including his concert works. It's being teared apart between baroque classicism and modernistic outbursts. A gem!
    I am extremely serious.
    • CommentAuthorTimmer
    • CommentTimeDec 22nd 2007
    Thor wrote
    The IMAGES score is fantastic! I've had it as an LP-to-CD transfer for years, and it's arguably Williams' most avantgardistic work - including his concert works. It's being teared apart between baroque classicism and modernistic outbursts. A gem!



    I agree with you but then I do have a taste for that style of music.

    I completely understand why it turns people off too.
    On Friday I ate a lot of dust and appeared orange near the end of the day ~ Bregt