register

  • Categories

Vanilla 1.1.4 is a product of Lussumo. More Information: Documentation, Community Support.

 

How great is it to be a score fan these passed few years?

General Discussions » How great is it to be a score fan these passed few years? (Posts 31 to 60 of 109)

  1. <
  2. 1
  3. 2
  4. 3
  5. 4
  6. >
    •  
      CommentAuthorRalph Kruhm
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2008 edited
    I´m sure people will roll eyes and call me a frakker or what for reopening this, but I went to bed early yesterday and had no chance to react to Erik´s usual trick of letting me look pycho while making himself out as the abodiment of intellect and wisdom.

    So, to everyone who still cares... (others, please feel free to ignore this)

    First of all, I´m quite shocked that everytime I say something about the constant whining, I get whipped with the freedom of speech flail, and I can´t believe that Erik gets away with that remark again and again. This is utter nonsense and you know it. I don´t want censoring, I want sense. For me, it doesn´t make any sense to constantly attack a fact of daily life that can´t be changed, especially when it comes uncalled for. The freedom of speech includes the freedom of choosing what to say.

    Second, yes, I am pissed about the constant whining. So what? How is me whining about the whining worse than the actual whining? Why am I called a freak with serious problems when all I am doing is asking whether all this negativity is really needed? Do we really want the negative more than the positive? Don´t I have the same right to whine, and, in this case, whine about something I can actually approach directly? The reason for my whining is right here, at this board, so why can´t I speak out about it? Why can Erik (and others) whine about things they don´t like and can´t change without being called freaks with serious problems?

    So, instead of facing the real matter at hand, Erik tries (again) to mark me as a psychopath, because that is so much easier than just admitting that he is a seriously bittered person who can let few threads go by without using the tiniest chance to whine about modern film scoring.

    Third, I don´t seek out Erik personally. I have been saying my opinion about the Zimmer bashing even when he wasn´t directly involved. And I have nothing against him. I had no problems saying good things about his Batman videos and thanking him for the work he did there. I had no problems thanking him for taking the time explaining to me something about the action tracks in the Prequel scores (some months ago). Really, when he comes across as a great guy, I am as friendly to him as everyone else is, and when he comes across as a bitch (which he often does and admits that he´s doing it), I leave him alone most of the time because of our history together. And even when he comes across as the snobbish bastard he tends to be while talking about great, classic scores and how superior they are and how superior his taste must be then, I keep my mouth shut. Hell, the way he talked down to Kiner´s score on his radio show was so agonizing and embarrassing that I cringed. But instead of saying something, I decided NOT to and leave him and the good reviews for his show alone. So, that´s how I´m seeking him out, hm?

    Really, guys, this was so NOT about Erik and me. This was about me enjoying an interesting topic for two posts, before somebody came along and called out how life sucks. And all I did was asking him to concentrate on the topic. I wasn´t too friendly about it, I know. But, honestly, how was that any worse than Erik´s constant crusade to mark me as a psycho when all I want is a bit of positive thinking around here?

    Seriously, reminding me how this is a discussion board and that everyone´s opinion is wanted around here, while telling me to leave here because my opinion pisses him off, that shows how much he really understands about discussions.

    To finish this off, as Erik and the others will not abandon their crusade against modern scoring, I see no reason why I should stop asking from time to time to end the constant whining. I have every right to do so, as much as Erik and the others have, regardless of how much they might hate that fact.

    Because, in the end, I am here because I love film music in all its forms, and from time to time, there are posts here that indicate I´m not alone.
  2. That said, yeah, I think all those releases are GREAT. I´m still waiting for some specific stuff to see the light of day, but releases like those Justin mentioned give me hope.

    Being a score fan HAS BEEN great these passed fgew years, and not only because of the old stuff releases.
  3. I like to be optimistic. I think the reason people keep complaining about modern scores is that deep down, they believe it's not too late for the artform to be saved.
    A butterfly thinks therefore I am
    •  
      CommentAuthorSteven
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2008
    Timmer wrote

    .....a right egit!


    Hehe, true dat. biggrin
    •  
      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2008
    I agree with Michael; there's a LOT OF GOOD music around these days, the fact that you have to search a bit more or elsewhere than the usual place (i.e. big Hollywood productions) that alone doesn't cancel the existence of the quality in film music as such.
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
    •  
      CommentAuthorRalph Kruhm
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2008 edited
    franz_conrad wrote
    I like to be optimistic. I think the reason people keep complaining about modern scores is that deep down, they believe it's not too late for the artform to be saved.

    Well, that´s the point, isn´t it? I don´t think the artform of film music is in any danger. But as music for silent movies changed into the style we got used to during the Golden Age, the style changed again into something else, until now we have a new form of scoring. That doesn´t mean that the old stuff is completely vanishing. It just steps aside a bit to make room for the next generation. Because this is all what´s happening, as the dozens of great orchestral scores that are composed each year prove. I understand that people would love to see their big Hollywood action stuff to be scored using the classic approach more often, but who - seriously - believes that this is going to happen? As I see it, we´ll see a new, different approach again in ten to twenty years from now. If you see me bitching about that then, you´re free to call me a dick. Until then, I just try to tolerate the evolution. Of course there are modern scores I don´t like, but there are lots of classical scores I don´t like, so where´s the difference?
    •  
      CommentAuthorRalph Kruhm
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2008 edited
    continued...

    You know, I think what I love most is that there is so much diversity now. You really can look around and choose the shoes that fit best for you.

    There is the great, honest-to-earth orchestral approach by the living members of the old guard (because even with its "shortcomings", Williams is still God, isn´t he?).

    There are the great thematic projects, like LOTR or The Golden Compass

    There is the not-seriously-meant-over-the-top orchestral approach, like Debney´s Lair, or Silvestri´s Van Helsing, which is a massive fun.

    There is the very interesting and inspiring approach by the new folk, Desplat being one of the finest examples.

    There is the fantastic, inventive and quiet approach we sometimes get from JNH.

    There is Zimmer when he´s good.

    There is Zimmer when he´s the way the old guard hates.

    There is Zimmer´s clones who are everything from very good to very bad and still manage to get things done the old way sometimes (Gregson-Williams´ Sinbad).

    There are curiosities like Solaris or The Fountain.

    There is great television scoring (Doctor Who, Lost, Robin Hood), there is great videogame scoring (Medal of Honor, Metal Gear Solid, and, again, Lair).

    And even with all these things going on, there is a great renaissance of Golden Age and Classic scores being rerecorded or published for the first time.

    Honestly, there is SO MUCH. How can it be so hard to say it´s GREAT to be a score fan right now? How can it be so hard to look at the stuff one likes instead of the stuff one doesn´t?
  8. Ralph Kruhm wrote
    franz_conrad wrote
    I like to be optimistic. I think the reason people keep complaining about modern scores is that deep down, they believe it's not too late for the artform to be saved.

    Well, that´s the point, isn´t it? I don´t think the artform of film music is in any danger.


    I might have been ribbing you, Ralph. wink
    A butterfly thinks therefore I am
    •  
      CommentAuthorSteven
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2008 edited
    I think it's great to generally be a music fan these days with the availability of so much music. I'm really surprised Erik doesn't listen to "classical" music since he loves the traditional scoring? I think the late romantic and on into much of the 20th century concert music would appeal to him a great deal (and would find where a lot of modern composers have gotten their influences from)... there's so much great music out there, not to mention many of the different modern genres created throughout the 20th century.
    •  
      CommentAuthorRalph Kruhm
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2008 edited
    franz_conrad wrote
    I might have been ribbing you, Ralph. wink

    I might have wanted to ignore that. beer

    Because, despite what some people say about me, I am totally able to enjoy myself and the world.
    •  
      CommentAuthorDemonStar
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2008 edited
    Just a little opinion of mine - I agree with what others have said and that if we don't like someone's comments, best to ignore them, or respectfully disagree and express our own opinion. There's nothing going to be gained by fighting over it, only good friends to be lost. You all know I am a big Zimmer fan and you can sure know how annoying it gets when people keep bashing your favourite composer over and over again. But I respect everyone's opinion even if I don't like them. And this holds true in offline life too, not just minor film music related topics. There were days when I had to be in a classroom among certain students like the tongue between 32 sharp teeth. We need to expand our tolerance in today's world to adjust. tongue wink

    And to bring this back to topic, I agree there have been many fantastic releases lately. All I want is the mighty The Lion King to be rescued from Disney's jaws and 25% of my aim in life is accomplished!!
    •  
      CommentAuthorRalph Kruhm
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2008 edited
    1. I absolutely respect his opinion, and to a certain degree, I even agree with him (that´s what makes this thing so rediculous in the first place - Yes, I like the modern approach way more than he does, but I would like more blockbusters to be scored the old fashioned way, too. But since I can´t change it, I don´t whine about it). So this is not exactly about opinion at all, but about the constant repetition of opinion even at places where it doesn´t belong, and that´s what I was talking about.
    2. I didn´t tell him to shut up or not state his opinion anymore, I asked him whether it would be possible to not do it in a topic where I felt it didn´t belong.
    3. His opinion is well known and noted already, hundreds of times, without me or anyone else interfering. So I rather doubt that he is in any danger of censorship by me if I ask him for a little selfcontrol.

    As usual, Erik is a master in blowing things up as if The American Way of Life itself was under attack by the Stupid German, while all I did was saying that his negativity in this positively aimed topic was getting on my nerves. So, can we leave it like that now or do I really have to defend myself for having nerves?
    •  
      CommentAuthorDemonStar
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2008
    Ralph Kruhm wrote
    So this is not exactly about opinion at all, but about the constant repetition of opinion even at places where it doesn´t belong, and that´s what I was talking about.
    2. I didn´t tell him to shut up or not state his opinion anymore, I asked him whether it would be possible to not do it in a topic where I felt it didn´t belong.


    Yeah, I know how you feel, man. But as you said, it's not just Erik who brings up the Zimmer bashing regularly. And I don't hide the fact that I have been seriously pissed off by users having a go at Zimmer at almost every mention of his name. But I choose not to say anything most times because I feel the following argument is only going to get only worse, with nothing to be gained for it. And neither is Zimmer going to change his style of scoring no matter what happens anyway. But of course, you have every right to defend yourself if you need. wink
    •  
      CommentAuthorplindboe
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2008
    You two need to learn to shrug your shoulders instead of taking each others' comments so seriously.

    That said, I agree with Ralph that there's much excellent film music today. There's always been hits and misses. One reason why people look at the olden days in such a fond light is because we tend to remember the hits and forget the misses. Sure, the Zimmer mode of scoring has had a big influence, but the orchestral score doesn't appear to be going anywhere. Instead we have a greater variety today, which I think is a good thing.

    Peter smile
    •  
      CommentAuthorDemonStar
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2008
    plindboe wrote
    You two need to learn to shrug your shoulders instead of taking each others' comments so seriously.


    That's what I do wink
    •  
      CommentAuthorMarselus
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2008
    plindboe wrote
    That said, I agree with Ralph that there's much excellent film music today. There's always been hits and misses. One reason why people look at the olden days in such a fond light is because we tend to remember the hits and forget the misses.

    That´s such a truth!
    It´s exactly the same I say to those "oh, cinema is dying, there are no more great films as in the past" guys / reviewers. Fuck them, there´s exactly the same great films as in the past, and the same horrible films as in the past. And exactly the same with music, as Peter says.
    Anything with an orchestra or with a choir....at some point will reach you
  17. DemonStar wrote
    It's not just Erik who brings up the Zimmer bashing regularly.

    I absolutely know that. I would have said a similar thing if someone else had posted what Erik did, but I admit that I would have chosen different words; I guess it was because of our history, and for that, I apologize, but not for the comment in general.

    And I don't hide the fact that I have been seriously pissed off by users having a go at Zimmer at almost every mention of his name. But I choose not to say anything most times because I feel the following argument is only going to get only worse, with nothing to be gained for it. And neither is Zimmer going to change his style of scoring no matter what happens anyway. But of course, you have every right to defend yourself if you need. wink

    Well, that´s part of the problem. I thought I wouldn´t have to defend myself for anything, because I thought everyone would agree with me (besides Erik, of course), that he was out of line there, but obviously, that wasn´t the case, so I had to defend myself after that and state that I am neither censoring anyone nor am I constantly and every time after Erik.
    •  
      CommentAuthorSteven
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2008
    plindboe wrote
    You two need to learn to shrug your shoulders instead of taking each others' comments so seriously.

    That said, I agree with Ralph that there's much excellent film music today. There's always been hits and misses. One reason why people look at the olden days in such a fond light is because we tend to remember the hits and forget the misses. Sure, the Zimmer mode of scoring has had a big influence, but the orchestral score doesn't appear to be going anywhere. Instead we have a greater variety today, which I think is a good thing.

    Peter smile


    I don't think the orchestral score will disappear too, it's been around since -I dunno- King Kong and before that I guess? There will always be trends throughout any musical movement (if film music can be branded a 'movement'?), but I think film makers will always return to an orchestral score.

    If things look bleak, it's only because we can't see beyond the fog. Whoa, deep.
  19. plindboe wrote
    You two need to learn to shrug your shoulders instead of taking each others' comments so seriously.

    Well, it´s hard if Erik´s only defense is calling me a psycho or telling me to just have fun. I can´t have fun with a score if he (or other guys´s) constantly try to tell me how bad my taste is for saying that a score like Iron Man is totally fitting to the movie it was written for. These days, stating a thing like that will get you comments whose energy alone melts the antarctic shelf.

    But you are right, of course, I shouldn´t take those comments too seriously. I guess I am only human after all.

    There's always been hits and misses. One reason why people look at the olden days in such a fond light is because we tend to remember the hits and forget the misses.

    Truer words were rarely spoken. Thanks.
    •  
      CommentAuthorMartijn
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2008
    Ralph Kruhm wrote
    The American Way of Life itself was under attack by the Stupid German


    Being the stickler for detail that I am, I feel I should be remiss if not pointing out that Erik is in fact Canadian. (Eh? wink )

    That said, chiming in at the topic at hand I find myself quite squarely in Justin's corner: the amount of re-issues and indeed rerecordings of long-lost or never-issued old gems seems staggering! I have already time and again sung the praises of the Bernstein Box (best and most ambitious soundtrack issue in the last decade, bar none), but things like the Superman Box, Godzilla and the rerecording of Steiner's She and Rozsa's El Cid are all dreams come true!

    Rest assured: I *am* counting my blessings: I'm from the generation having to scour from city to city looking for that one elusive LP. and whil -when successful- that was most gratifying, I couldn't even begin to dream of the wealth of material now easily available today.

    On the tangent sub-subject: I agree with Erik up to a point. I don't think there's more shit coming out (in fact Ralph did a fine job of pointing out some lovely to excellent examples of modern scoring), but I do think that the true "highs", the ones with potential iconic status, are more few and far between than they used to be, say, thirty to forty years ago.

    Obviously though time will tell (and not a little of any iconic status can be written up to personal preference. After all: "many of the truths we kling to... "smile )
    'no passion nor excitement here, despite all the notes and musicians' ~ Falkirkbairn
    •  
      CommentAuthorDemonStar
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2008 edited
    Ralph Kruhm wrote
    I can´t have fun with a score if he (or other guys´s) constantly try to tell me how bad my taste is for saying that a score like Iron Man is totally fitting to the movie it was written for. These days, stating a thing like that will get you comments whose energy alone melts the antarctic shelf.


    I don't think anyone calling a score worthless ruins the fun. Just ignore those comments if you don't like them. Why, people call ME a psycho because I listen to "random background music from films which doesn't even have words". And they say it in my face, if front of everyone, not online! So does it ruin my fun? No! I am proud to be a listener of "random background music!". I know it can be hard but it is helpful if you look at it this way. Just a little sharing of my experience to help you. smile beer
    •  
      CommentAuthorDemonStar
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2008
    I want to see the day in future when TODAY's scores are considered classics and given releases like The Golden Age scores! Starting with The Lion King!!!
    •  
      CommentAuthorRalph Kruhm
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2008 edited
    Martijn wrote
    Ralph Kruhm wrote
    The American Way of Life itself was under attack by the Stupid German

    Being the stickler for detail that I am, I feel I should be remiss if not pointing out that Erik is in fact Canadian. (Eh? wink )

    So he IS a citizen of an american continent, isn´t he? wink (Just being a stickler myself)

    in fact Ralph did a fine job of pointing out some lovely to excellent examples of modern scoring)

    Thanks. I tried, and it wasn´t so hard.

    but I do think that the true "highs", the ones with potential iconic status, are more few and far between than they used to be, say, thirty to forty years ago.

    Well, I guess iconic status comes with great popularity, and the fact that movies are by far more criticized today than just enjoyed is part of the problem. A big cultural success like Star Wars is impossible today, there is just too much going on everywhere. There is TV that equals cinema in production quality; there is videogames. Too much entertainment is fighting for the awareness of the audience, and what we get as a result are much fewer iconics respected by the whole of the audience as was the case thrity or forty years ago. I would say its not the quality, but the quantity that´s the problem here.
    •  
      CommentAuthorMarselus
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2008 edited
    Martijn wrote
    I do think that the true "highs", the ones with potential iconic status, are more few and far between than they used to be, say, thirty to forty years ago.

    This could be a sentence taken from a forum in the 80´s, the 90´s, or the year 2145. It´s all about perspective. Sadly, we won´t live enough to know which scores will be considered classics. How many films were trashed, savaged, etc in the past and are now considered classics or cult films? And how many scores? Perspective and time, that´s the point. In the meantime, have fun!
    Anything with an orchestra or with a choir....at some point will reach you
    •  
      CommentAuthorDemonStar
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2008
    Marselus wrote
    Martijn wrote
    I do think that the true "highs", the ones with potential iconic status, are more few and far between than they used to be, say, thirty to forty years ago.

    This could be a sentence taken from a forum in the 80´s, the 90´s, or the year 2145. It´s all about perspective. Sadly, we won´t live enough to know which scores will be considered classics. How many films were trashed, savaged, etc in the past and are now considered classics or cult films? And how many scores? Perspective and time, that´s the point.


    I want to live enough to at least see some of my favourite scores being given releases like Alien and LoTR!!
  26. DemonStar wrote
    I want to see the day in future when TODAY's scores are considered classics and given releases like The Golden Age scores! Starting with The Lion King!!!

    If this wouldn´t fit to the topic, I would try to oppress your opinion now by asking you to leave it alone for once, but there you are... biggrin
    •  
      CommentAuthorDemonStar
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2008
    Ralph Kruhm wrote
    DemonStar wrote
    I want to see the day in future when TODAY's scores are considered classics and given releases like The Golden Age scores! Starting with The Lion King!!!

    If this wouldn´t fit to the topic, I would try to oppress your opinion now by asking you to leave it alone for once, but there you are... biggrin


    Haha! lol
    •  
      CommentAuthorRalph Kruhm
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2008 edited
    DemonStar wrote
    I don't think anyone calling a score worthless ruins the fun. (...)

    I came out of my first viewing of The Fellowship of the Ring, being totally at awe about the greatness of that movie and the mood it let me leave the theatre in. The first thing that happened to me when I came out, being totally happy about the experience? A friend of mine, standing right next to me, stating what a stupid dick the actor for Aragorn had been.

    I guess that traumatized me for life. biggrin

    Of course LOTR isn´t the 100% perfect experience, BUT it´s very, very close, and I will never understand how people get more fun out of criticizing what they disliked instead of being happy about what they liked.

    So yeah, I know it´s my problem that I feel my fun being ruined by others that easily. But I think I have a point, too.
    •  
      CommentAuthorMartijn
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2008
    Marselus wrote
    Martijn wrote
    I do think that the true "highs", the ones with potential iconic status, are more few and far between than they used to be, say, thirty to forty years ago.

    This could be a sentence taken from a forum in the 80´s, the 90´s, or the year 2145. It´s all about perspective.


    I disagree. Like I argued, it's mostly about perspective, but there are certain marks of quality which can be measured (such as critical response, percentage of record sales et cetera), giving at least a measure of comparison. It might be an interesting intellectual excercise to take -say- half a decade in the fifties or sixties and compare it to a half a decade in the nineties or 2000s.

    I can't be arsed right now, though. wink
    'no passion nor excitement here, despite all the notes and musicians' ~ Falkirkbairn
    •  
      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeAug 19th 2008 edited
    Marselus wrote
    Martijn wrote
    I do think that the true "highs", the ones with potential iconic status, are more few and far between than they used to be, say, thirty to forty years ago.

    This could be a sentence taken from a forum in the 80´s, the 90´s, or the year 2145. It´s all about perspective. Sadly, we won´t live enough to know which scores will be considered classics. How many films were trashed, savaged, etc in the past and are now considered classics or cult films? And how many scores? Perspective and time, that´s the point. In the meantime, have fun!


    You lived enough to see STAR WARS and INDIANA JONES turning into classics, haven't you?

    Martijn wrote
    Marselus wrote
    Martijn wrote
    I do think that the true "highs", the ones with potential iconic status, are more few and far between than they used to be, say, thirty to forty years ago.

    This could be a sentence taken from a forum in the 80´s, the 90´s, or the year 2145. It´s all about perspective.


    I disagree. Like I argued, it's mostly about perspective, but there are certain marks of quality which can be measured (such as critical response, percentage of record sales et cetera), giving at least a measure of comparison. It might be an interesting intellectual excercise to take -say- half a decade in the fifties or sixties and compare it to a half a decade in the nineties or 2000s.

    I can't be arsed right now, though. wink


    Agree.
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.

31 to 60 of 109

  1. <
  2. 1
  3. 2
  4. 3
  5. 4
  6. >