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The Dark Knight

Film, TV & DVD » The Dark Knight (Posts 121 to 150 of 177)

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      CommentAuthorRalph Kruhm
    • CommentTimeAug 11th 2008 edited
    Martijn wrote
    Cameron might have Titanic'd it up, Scott might have Legended it up.

    Cameron was the hero of hard ass action cinema at that time, and mentioning Legend while Scott had done things like Alien, Blade Runner, and Black Rain, all three of them 100% closer to the atmosphere a Batman movie by him might have had, and you´re telling me I´m using silly arguments?

    I don´t think Burton´s version was in any way time-specific. It was Burton-specific. ANY other director would have made a different version. If you love the corny and the crazy versions, be my guest, but don´t call me silly just because I don´t.
    •  
      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeAug 11th 2008
    I too fail to see how Burton's version is anyhow more original than what any other director would do with his Batman - or for the subject matter, Christopher Nolan's vision and its originality. How is it lesser than Burton's?
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
  3. Burton was original as long as his weirdness wasn´t as worn out as it is today. But knowing what we know about him now clarifies that Batman wasn´t original at all. It was just how Burton would do a Batman movie. Cameron would have made a Cameron Batman. Scott would have made a Scott Batman. And Nolan did his Nolan Batman. I wouldn´t call ANY of these versions original. It´s just the way these guys make their movies, and if one defends Burton´s Batman, he actually defends Burton´s style, not Burton´s Batman. I can live with that. But I would have preferred to see a different Batman then. And that´s all I´m saying here.
    •  
      CommentAuthorMarselus
    • CommentTimeAug 11th 2008
    Ralph Kruhm wrote
    Nolan got my attention with Batman Begins, and then The Prestige absolutely blew me away. I haven´t seen anything else, but I´m going to, definitely.

    Martijn, your point about a new Batman version for each generation doesn´t give the fact justice that at the time where Burton´s Batman came out, a hard-ass serious version would have been possible if the right director would have jumped onto the project. That´s what I meant with my James Cameron / Ridley Scott comment. If one of them would have done it, we would have had a great version right there. There was no need for Burton´s freakshow.

    Watch Memento and Insomnia ASAP Ralph. Won´t disappoint you.
    Anything with an orchestra or with a choir....at some point will reach you
    •  
      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeAug 11th 2008
    Marselus wrote
    Ralph Kruhm wrote
    Nolan got my attention with Batman Begins, and then The Prestige absolutely blew me away. I haven´t seen anything else, but I´m going to, definitely.

    Martijn, your point about a new Batman version for each generation doesn´t give the fact justice that at the time where Burton´s Batman came out, a hard-ass serious version would have been possible if the right director would have jumped onto the project. That´s what I meant with my James Cameron / Ridley Scott comment. If one of them would have done it, we would have had a great version right there. There was no need for Burton´s freakshow.

    Watch Memento and Insomnia ASAP Ralph. Won´t disappoint you.


    Agree to that; Memento is a very clever and influential film that has spawned countless cheap imitations and Insomnia has an oddly charming atmosphere throughout and top performances. In Prestige and The Dark Knight he outdid himself so far, imo.
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
  6. Thanks, guys, I´ll put those movies on the list, then.
    •  
      CommentAuthorMartijn
    • CommentTimeAug 11th 2008 edited
    Ralph Kruhm wrote
    If you love the corny and the crazy versions, be my guest, but don´t call me silly just because I don´t.


    I didn't.
    I said that liking non-existant, hypothetical versions was silly, and I stand by that.
    Alien isn't Batman. Terminator isn't Batman (although interestingly in comics there have been crossovers between all three franchises smile ). We wouldn't know what Cameron or Scott would have done with Batman until they actually did it. So nobody can say it would be better or worse. The best we can do is speculate, based on aspects we like...or dislike. Which is why I referenced Titanic and Legend. That speculation is no more or less valid than yours.
    And yes, it's silly too!

    I happen to think Burton is a wonderful, visual, dream-state storyteller with very few flaws (until, interestingly, the very generic, easy and by-the-numbers Big Fish, which left me completely cold) whose style wonderfully fitted a certain aspect of the Batman archetype.

    I think Nolan is very close to my favourite Bat-era (that of the early seventies), which I think works brilliantly.

    Like I said: I like ALL versions. If there's a vision there, I'll take it.

    Ralph Kruhm wrote...I would have preferred to see a different Batman then. And that´s all I´m saying here.


    smile C'est la vie.
    I just think that you do Burton a disservice by using phrases like "freak show", "zany" and "corny".
    'no passion nor excitement here, despite all the notes and musicians' ~ Falkirkbairn
    •  
      CommentAuthorRalph Kruhm
    • CommentTimeAug 11th 2008 edited
    I only used freak show; zany and corny had been used by other guys before, and I just reused them. biggrin

    And yes, it IS interesting that the only Burton movie that ever worked for me left you cold.

    And I speculate that I would have preferred cameron´s or Scott´s version EVEN if they were Titanicked or Legended. tongue
    •  
      CommentAuthorMartijn
    • CommentTimeAug 11th 2008
    Ralph Kruhm wrote
    I only used freak show; zany and corny had been used by other guys before, and I just reused them. biggrin


    Hmmm...evil and twisted guys without a soul, obviously...wink

    And yes, it IS interesting that the only Burton movie that ever worked for me left you cold.


    Yeah. I wasn't even saying that to be obtuse either (how against character tongue ). It's the god honest truth!

    And I speculate that I would have preferred cameron´s or Scott´s version EVEN if they were Titanicked or Legended. tongue


    EEEEEEeeeeeehhhhh!!! shocked shocked shocked
    Ralph...sometimes you scare me!
    wink
    'no passion nor excitement here, despite all the notes and musicians' ~ Falkirkbairn
    •  
      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeAug 11th 2008
    Heh. Imagine DiCaprio playing Batman over Celine Dion's cheeeeeeeesy vocals singing his lost love with Rachel. vomit
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
    • CommentAuthorTimmer
    • CommentTimeAug 11th 2008
    Martijn wrote
    rolleyes

    Never mind. The people who were supposed to get the point, got it.
    No point in flogging a dead bat.


    I'm not a fan of Burton's films though both are still very watchable.

    And yeah Martijn, I understand and agree on every point you've made here today.
    On Friday I ate a lot of dust and appeared orange near the end of the day ~ Bregt
  12. Martijn wrote
    Ralph Kruhm wrote
    And I speculate that I would have preferred Cameron´s or Scott´s version EVEN if they were Titanicked or Legended. tongue


    EEEEEEeeeeeehhhhh!!! shocked shocked shocked
    Ralph...sometimes you scare me!
    wink

    I meant I would have preferred them over Burton´s version.

    But I must admit that I actually like Titanic as a whole, and some stuff from Legend, too.
    •  
      CommentAuthorRobinson
    • CommentTimeAug 17th 2008
    The dark knight is a much more complex movie than it seems after watching it. It deals with a lot of issues including corruption, (in all levels) anarchy, morality and ethics.... I really found the script very well written, pretty smart and sharp as any other great crime thriller or drama.
    The most amazing thing about this movie is the ability of Nolan to tell this story in such original, realistic, dramatic and fluid way that you never realize it is based on a comic character.. but...who cares??!!!!
    Batman is the more complex and realistic comic character ever created.....
    Robinson
    •  
      CommentAuthorNautilus
    • CommentTimeAug 17th 2008
    Robinson wrote

    Batman is the more complex and realistic comic character ever created.....


    i don't see any diference between Wayne's tragedy than other superheros.
    •  
      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeAug 17th 2008
    Nautilus wrote
    Robinson wrote

    Batman is the more complex and realistic comic character ever created.....


    i don't see any diference between Wayne's tragedy than other superheros.


    yeah....spiderman and fantastic four or Zorro are very troubled beings rolleyes
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
    •  
      CommentAuthorSteven
    • CommentTimeAug 17th 2008
    Zorro isn't a superhero in the sense that Batman is. Yeah okay, they both don't have any "special powers", but I've never really classed Zorro in the same category as Hulk, Batman, Spider-Man, and all those characters. (Partly because Zorro is a period character, whereas Batman, Spider-Man and Hulk are present day characters.)

    Also, Zorro makes for better music!
    •  
      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeAug 17th 2008
    Steven wrote

    Also, Zorro makes for better music!


    Only in the first one which is admittedly a great score and also contains the BEAUTIFUL song! The 2nd score made me asleep, generic and on auto-pilot retake of the first one.
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
    •  
      CommentAuthorSteven
    • CommentTimeAug 17th 2008
    I agree the first Zorro score is by far the best, but I wouldn't go as far as calling the second one generic or on auto-pilot. It's a bloody good score in my opinion, with a fantastic last few tracks. The first score just wins for emotional narrative for me, that's what the second film and score lack.
    •  
      CommentAuthorAntineutrino
    • CommentTimeAug 17th 2008 edited
    * wrong thread *
    • CommentAuthorAnthony
    • CommentTimeAug 17th 2008
    Christodoulides wrote
    Steven wrote

    Also, Zorro makes for better music!


    Only in the first one which is admittedly a great score and also contains the BEAUTIFUL song! The 2nd score made me asleep, generic and on auto-pilot retake of the first one.


    No way. If anything I love the second even more than the first!
    • CommentAuthorTimmer
    • CommentTimeAug 17th 2008
    Christodoulides wrote
    Nautilus wrote
    Robinson wrote

    Batman is the more complex and realistic comic character ever created.....


    i don't see any diference between Wayne's tragedy than other superheros.


    yeah....spiderman and fantastic four or Zorro are very troubled beings rolleyes


    Forget Zorro.

    Both Spidey and the FF have troubles, the Thing in paricular is trapped in a hideous body.
    On Friday I ate a lot of dust and appeared orange near the end of the day ~ Bregt
    •  
      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeAug 17th 2008
    That doesn't compare with the ethic and social questions and dilemmas brought up in Nolan's Batman films and in any case, "i don't see any diference between Wayne's tragedy than other superheros." is far-fetched imo.
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
    • CommentAuthorTimmer
    • CommentTimeAug 17th 2008
    Christodoulides wrote
    That doesn't compare with the ethic and social questions and dilemmas brought up in Nolan's Batman films and in any case, "i don't see any diference between Wayne's tragedy than other superheros." is far-fetched imo.


    I haven't seen DK. My statement is more about the comic book source than the films.
    On Friday I ate a lot of dust and appeared orange near the end of the day ~ Bregt
    •  
      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeAug 17th 2008
    Timmer wrote
    Christodoulides wrote
    That doesn't compare with the ethic and social questions and dilemmas brought up in Nolan's Batman films and in any case, "i don't see any diference between Wayne's tragedy than other superheros." is far-fetched imo.


    I haven't seen DK. My statement is more about the comic book source than the films.


    Ok, no need to get cloudy biggrin
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
    •  
      CommentAuthorSteven
    • CommentTimeAug 17th 2008
    Christodoulides wrote
    Timmer wrote
    Christodoulides wrote
    That doesn't compare with the ethic and social questions and dilemmas brought up in Nolan's Batman films and in any case, "i don't see any diference between Wayne's tragedy than other superheros." is far-fetched imo.


    I haven't seen DK. My statement is more about the comic book source than the films.


    Ok, no need to get cloudy biggrin



    Best. Lolcat. Ever.
    • CommentAuthorAnthony
    • CommentTimeAug 17th 2008
    Steven wrote
    Christodoulides wrote
    Timmer wrote
    Christodoulides wrote
    That doesn't compare with the ethic and social questions and dilemmas brought up in Nolan's Batman films and in any case, "i don't see any diference between Wayne's tragedy than other superheros." is far-fetched imo.


    I haven't seen DK. My statement is more about the comic book source than the films.


    Ok, no need to get cloudy biggrin



    Best. Lolcat. Ever.


    Pfft, I've seen much better ones than that. rolleyes

    *runs for cover*

    wink
    •  
      CommentAuthorNautilus
    • CommentTimeAug 18th 2008
    All the movie is a great puzzle. Every piece is there for something....

    But ....SPOILER

    what Batman does with the print of the bullet ?
    • CommentAuthorAnthony
    • CommentTimeAug 18th 2008
    Nautilus wrote
    All the movie is a great puzzle. Every piece is there for something....

    But ....SPOILER

    what Batman does with the print of the bullet ?


    There's so much that goes on in that movie I can't remember most of it. *patiently awaiting DVD*
    •  
      CommentAuthorRobinson
    • CommentTimeAug 27th 2008
    The dark knight is easily the best film Ive seen this year and at the end of the year it should be listed among the better films of this 2008 by most critics. It is an outstanding film overall....

    I know it is too early but it should get multiple Oscar nominations including Best Picture, Screenplay, Cinematography, Editing, Director (Nolan) and Acting either leading or supporting by Heath Ledger. Of course I´m not mentioning all the nominations the film would get for its technical aspects..

    The score is amazingly good in the film but I´m not sure if the voters will be quite please by nominating a score with a few musical elements from its predecessor....
    Robinson
  30. The score is already ruled out, because it has two composers.
    http://www.filmmusic.pl - Polish Film Music Review Website

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