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      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeAug 4th 2009
    franz_conrad wrote
    Christodoulides wrote

    Too bad he had a great score by Horner and decided to chop it off and shoot it away replacing it with classical pieces.


    Too bad he's one of the few directors out there who does what needs to be done.
    (The longer version of The New World btw, with an extra 42 mins, has a bit more of the Horner score.)


    What's need to be done? That means that the score was so bad that it had to be chopped and replaced with classical music? Why hire the film composer the first place then? Or why didn't he reject it and get a replacement score? I thought the score Horner wrote was very good for the instance but if he didn't like it, there are options. smile
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
  1. That's the way Malick does it, even to Ennio Morricone (Days of Heaven). The only score Malick left practically unscathed (though it was reworked ALL THE TIME) was The Thin Red Line.
    http://www.filmmusic.pl - Polish Film Music Review Website
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      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeAug 4th 2009
    PawelStroinski wrote
    The only score Malick left practically unscathed (though it was reworked ALL THE TIME) was The Thin Red Line.


    That says something about the score, doesn't it? wink
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
  2. Yes. And Hans Zimmer as a person.
    http://www.filmmusic.pl - Polish Film Music Review Website
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      CommentAuthorSouthall
    • CommentTimeAug 5th 2009
    PawelStroinski wrote
    DreamTheater wrote
    Never heard that one, I only ever got the sequel score, which I think is pretty damn good. But I think it's at least as original as Patriot Games, isn't it? As in not very.


    Oh, and the classical rip-offs are the same - both scores copy Khachaturian's Adagio and Shostakovich's 5th Symphony. Clear and Present Danger only adds Aaron Copland to the mix.


    Much more enjoyable though, isn't it? He ripped that Khachaturian for Aliens too, didn't he? I love the main titles from C&PD.
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      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeAug 5th 2009
    BEN FOSTER-Torchwood: Children of Earth

    Heart it once so far, can't remember much to be honest; just some pseudo-classical film scoring lost along Zimmer / Rc-isms and stuff that resembled the former's BATMAN scores.
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
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      CommentAuthorSouthall
    • CommentTimeAug 5th 2009
    Christodoulides wrote
    PawelStroinski wrote
    The only score Malick left practically unscathed (though it was reworked ALL THE TIME) was The Thin Red Line.


    That says something about the score, doesn't it? wink


    I dunno. How much score did Zimmer have to record before Malick was happy with it? It was hours and hours and hours - can't now remember precisely how many (though Zimmer said it in an interview at the time). It's great music, but I don't think much of it is used in the way Zimmer had envisaged when recording it.

    I suspect Days of Heaven is the least messed-around score in a Malick film, despite the Saint-Saens.
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      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeAug 5th 2009
    Well, regardless of what was left behind in THE THIN RED LINE, the music in the film definitely didn't sound chopped off nor fragmented.
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
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      CommentAuthorSouthall
    • CommentTimeAug 5th 2009
    Christodoulides wrote
    Well, regardless of what was left behind in THE THIN RED LINE, the music in the film definitely didn't sound chopped off nor fragmented.


    Indeed not. Thanks to its visionary director. I love what Horner wrote for The New World - I think the album is the very strongest film music album of this decade - but Malick made the right choices in that film, too.
  3. It was 6 hours worth of music written in 9 months time.
    http://www.filmmusic.pl - Polish Film Music Review Website
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      CommentAuthorlp
    • CommentTimeAug 5th 2009
    NP: Transfomers: The Movie - Vince DiCola

    Catchy, dynamic themes, intricate synth work, bombastic action cues, diverse arrangements. Perfect example of the best synth score of the 80s.
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      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeAug 5th 2009
    Southall wrote
    Christodoulides wrote
    Well, regardless of what was left behind in THE THIN RED LINE, the music in the film definitely didn't sound chopped off nor fragmented.


    Indeed not. Thanks to its visionary director. I love what Horner wrote for The New World - I think the album is the very strongest film music album of this decade - but Malick made the right choices in that film, too.


    You think it didn't suite the movie?
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
  4. Christodoulides wrote
    Well, regardless of what was left behind in THE THIN RED LINE, the music in the film definitely didn't sound chopped off nor fragmented.


    If you know the material well, it could. There's a few edits that border on dodgy, but there's usually enough going on in the sound effects track to disguise it. Interestingly, there's a lot of classical music in The Thin Red Line too - from Faure, Charles Ives, Arsenije Jovanovich, Arvo Part (the last one interpolated into the score, the rest are achieved by music edits, and even playing them at the same time as the Zimmer score). The hymns - both western and Polynesian - that make up most of the melodies in the score were obviously pre-existing ideas that Zimmer felt ok with including in his score.

    As to why you'd throw out a Horner score in place of classical favourites, you'd do it because they each give the film a different feel, and one of them (the classical stuff) was felt to make the film better. And it's not as though the replacements aren't worthy compositions. Stanley Kubrick would answer that one best (paraphrased): "If you could have the best music ever written, by Beethoven or Mozart or Ligeti, the best that Hollywood's craftsmen have to offer never fails to seem poor by comparison."

    I've chucked out scores for much the same reason. You ask why would you even work with a composer, if that was going to happen? Well, because you didn't know when you started out that that was going to happen. Or - to risk a joke at Horner's expense - perhaps Malick thought in hiring Horner he was going to get a bunch of recycled classical pieces in the first place? wink
    A butterfly thinks therefore I am
  5. Michael, is the trumpet piece used right after the camp massacre classical or Zimmer? If it's classical, what piece is it?
    http://www.filmmusic.pl - Polish Film Music Review Website
  6. PawelStroinski wrote
    Michael, is the trumpet piece used right after the camp massacre classical or Zimmer? If it's classical, what piece is it?


    That is a performance of Charles Ives' tone poem 'The Unanswered Question'. It's a recording that features only the trumpet and string parts of the piece. The flute quartet that attempts to 'answer' the trumpet's question (often quite desperately) isn't present in the recording used for THIN RED LINE.

    Here the Ives' piece replaced the second half of Zimmer's 'Journey to the Line' cue, a cue which is clearly aiming for a similar feel to 'Unanswered Question'. Zimmer ended up recycling that section of the cue for THE LAST SAMURAI, for the *spoiler* death scene of Ken Watanabe's second-last samurai *end spoiler*.
    A butterfly thinks therefore I am
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      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeAug 5th 2009
    franz_conrad wrote
    "If you could have the best music ever written, by Beethoven or Mozart or Ligeti, the best that Hollywood's craftsmen have to offer never fails to seem poor by comparison."


    A bit over-stretched, but it has truth in it; although i'd never limit it down to just film music; those men outdid everyone ever since, in every musical genre. But that's not the point here, nobody is competing with the greats. FILM has way different needs that what classical music can offer to it, imo, with some exceptions.
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
  7. franz_conrad wrote
    PawelStroinski wrote
    Michael, is the trumpet piece used right after the camp massacre classical or Zimmer? If it's classical, what piece is it?


    That is a performance of Charles Ives' tone poem 'The Unanswered Question'. It's a recording that features only the trumpet and string parts of the piece. The flute quartet that attempts to 'answer' the trumpet's question (often quite desperately) isn't present in the recording used for THIN RED LINE.

    Here the Ives' piece replaced the second half of Zimmer's 'Journey to the Line' cue, a cue which is clearly aiming for a similar feel to 'Unanswered Question'. Zimmer ended up recycling that section of the cue for THE LAST SAMURAI, for the *spoiler* death scene of Ken Watanabe's second-last samurai *end spoiler*.


    The Lohengrin prelude rip-off?
    http://www.filmmusic.pl - Polish Film Music Review Website
  8. PawelStroinski wrote
    franz_conrad wrote
    PawelStroinski wrote
    Michael, is the trumpet piece used right after the camp massacre classical or Zimmer? If it's classical, what piece is it?


    That is a performance of Charles Ives' tone poem 'The Unanswered Question'. It's a recording that features only the trumpet and string parts of the piece. The flute quartet that attempts to 'answer' the trumpet's question (often quite desperately) isn't present in the recording used for THIN RED LINE.

    Here the Ives' piece replaced the second half of Zimmer's 'Journey to the Line' cue, a cue which is clearly aiming for a similar feel to 'Unanswered Question'. Zimmer ended up recycling that section of the cue for THE LAST SAMURAI, for the *spoiler* death scene of Ken Watanabe's second-last samurai *end spoiler*.


    The Lohengrin prelude rip-off?


    Well, there's a point. The first half of 'Journey to the Line' is written in the spirit of a Wagner prelude. (Up until the crescendo about 4-5 minutes in.) This is all in the film. It's the other five minutes that seem to want to reference Ives, which weren't in TRL, and which were reworked for THE LAST SAMURAI.
    A butterfly thinks therefore I am
  9. Christodoulides wrote
    franz_conrad wrote
    "If you could have the best music ever written, by Beethoven or Mozart or Ligeti, the best that Hollywood's craftsmen have to offer never fails to seem poor by comparison."


    A bit over-stretched, but it has truth in it; although i'd never limit it down to just film music; those men outdid everyone ever since, in every musical genre. But that's not the point here, nobody is competing with the greats. FILM has way different needs that what classical music can offer to it, imo, with some exceptions.


    It's a tricky one. Essentially my three favourite living directors - Terence Malick, Michael Mann and Wong Kar Wai - are all set on messing with the film composer's natural way of doing things. But they make great films, consistently. It's hard to say they're not right in the long run.
    A butterfly thinks therefore I am
    • CommentAuthorTimmer
    • CommentTimeAug 5th 2009 edited
    Nautilus wrote
    Timmer wrote
    NP : THE DARK KNIGHT - Hans Zimmer & James Newton Howard



    In my book this score is okay but nothing to get hyped about ( which it seriously was, at least on this board ).

    As for the film I think it deserved a better score.


    I think this score is one of the biggest achievements in Zimmer's career.


    I think it's a shame JNH wasn't just given the project to himself. As I said earlier it is an enjoyable listen but it really isn't anything special, the film IS special and deserved better.

    dino <-parrot
    On Friday I ate a lot of dust and appeared orange near the end of the day ~ Bregt
    • CommentAuthorTimmer
    • CommentTimeAug 5th 2009
    Christodoulides wrote
    franz_conrad wrote
    "If you could have the best music ever written, by Beethoven or Mozart or Ligeti, the best that Hollywood's craftsmen have to offer never fails to seem poor by comparison."


    A bit over-stretched, but it has truth in it; although i'd never limit it down to just film music; those men outdid everyone ever since, in every musical genre. But that's not the point here, nobody is competing with the greats. FILM has way different needs that what classical music can offer to it, imo, with some exceptions.


    Word D.

    Given the needs of the film would Beethoven, Mozart ( Li - friggin - geti? confused ) have composed anything better than what Horner did?
    On Friday I ate a lot of dust and appeared orange near the end of the day ~ Bregt
    • CommentAuthorMatt C
    • CommentTimeAug 5th 2009
    Southall wrote
    Christodoulides wrote
    Well, regardless of what was left behind in THE THIN RED LINE, the music in the film definitely didn't sound chopped off nor fragmented.


    Indeed not. Thanks to its visionary director. I love what Horner wrote for The New World - I think the album is the very strongest film music album of this decade - but Malick made the right choices in that film, too.


    I'm very interested in seeing what Malick's done with The Tree of Life, especially since Alexandre Desplat's working on it. Hopefully Desplat was willing to accomodate the inevitable edits and rearrangements more than Horner did.

    And the soundtrack should be something to hear. Malick almost always coaxes the best out of the composers he works with.
    http://unsungfilmscores.blogspot.com/ -- My film/TV/game score review blog
  10. Timmer wrote

    Given the needs of the film would Beethoven, Mozart ( Li - friggin - geti? confused ) have composed anything better than what Horner did?


    I assume Kubrick was justifying his own use of music there, not Terence Malick's use of music 15-20 years later. wink
    A butterfly thinks therefore I am
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      CommentAuthorErik Woods
    • CommentTimeAug 5th 2009 edited
    NP: Drag Me To Hell - Christopher Young

    It's about 12:20am here and I'm blasting the shit out of this winner from horror master Christopher Young and it is sending shivers down my back!. Horror is a genre Young is VERY comfortable in and this time (unlike The Uninvited) Young reinvents himself and hits a homerun... no, a 9th inning 2 out World Series clinching grand-slam with this one. I don't know if I've heard a scarier track this year or in recent memory than "Loose Teeth!" The grotesque and unholy sounds heard at the 4:20 mark literal scared me out of my seat. I've never heard such sounds in the a film score. "Loose Teeth" is a definite candidate for track of the year... and the score is up there in my short list for score of the year!

    THIS. IS. A. GREAT. HORROR. SCORE!

    EDIT - "Auto-Da-Fe" has to be heard to be believed! This second to last track opens with this cheesy organ riff which is utterly fantastic and then explodes into a frenetic piece that, while sounds unorganized, is a testament to Young's skills as a composer to create such a beautiful and wonderful piece of chaos! And then Young closes one of the strongest scores of the year with a horror concerto the likes of we have never heard! The brilliant, gypsy-like violin theme heard at the beginning of the score and throughout gets to really stretch its wings here. It is then joined for the final 2 minutes by full symphony and chorus in what is easily one of the most satisfying conclusions to an album I've heard in a while! Absolutely brilliant!!! This will get multiple spins from now until the end of the year and is, IMHO, up there with Young's very best scores!

    Highly , HIGHLY recommended!

    -Erik-
    host and producer of CINEMATIC SOUND RADIO | www.cinematicsound.net | www.facebook.com/cinematicsound | I HAVE TINNITUS!
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      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeAug 5th 2009
    Glad you liked it Erik, truly Young is a master in this territory, and he wins the title very comfortably smile
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
  11. It sounds very scary. Not sure if I'm up for it! wink
    A butterfly thinks therefore I am
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      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeAug 5th 2009
    n.p. CHRISTOPHER YOUNG - drag me to hell

    This composer could kick anyone's ass when it comes to horror movie scoring, he's the absolute master i must say. punk
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
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      CommentAuthorSouthall
    • CommentTimeAug 5th 2009
    Matt C wrote
    I'm very interested in seeing what Malick's done with The Tree of Life, especially since Alexandre Desplat's working on it. Hopefully Desplat was willing to accomodate the inevitable edits and rearrangements more than Horner did.

    And the soundtrack should be something to hear. Malick almost always coaxes the best out of the composers he works with.


    I am greatly looking forward to both film and score, but a little nervous about what fate might befall Desplat. While as a film composer he's nothing like Horner, he IS a bit "proper" in his approach, like Horner, rather than being more like Malick's other past composers Morricone or Zimmer, happier working in that more "fluid" environment.
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      CommentAuthorRalph Kruhm
    • CommentTimeAug 5th 2009 edited
    Patriot Games
    Indeed, probably one of Horner´s best Main Themes. It gets a nice second treatment during the End Credits, and there´s a second track in the same style with a different theme, Highland´s Execution, that gets me goosebumping all over every time I hear it. Due to the movie´s story, we get a lot of flute and whistle work throughout the score, including the action tracks, which gave Horner´s rather typical action work a slightly unusual and interesting approach, long before Braveheart. You actually could compare this score more to Red Heat than to Clear & Present Danger. While there are similarities, C&PD has a lot more power most of the time. Clearly a case of this is the sequel, so pump up the volume a bit. But I would recommend Patriot Games anytime to anyone who likes Horner and/or The Wailing Women (TM) (Irish Version).

    The Dark Knight
    I wouldn´t mind if the next sequel would be composed not by the team but by Zimmer or JNH alone. It certainly would be different and interesting. Not sure which one would come out better, though.

    Drag me to Hell
    A new great Horror score by Young? Count me in, I have a lot of Horror-themed RPG sessions in front of me and was looking for new stuff to scare my players anyway. To anyone who´s already listened to it: Which former Young score would this one compare most to?
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      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeAug 5th 2009
    Ralph Kruhm wrote
    Drag me to Hell
    A new great Horror score by Young? Count me in, I have a lot of Horror-themed RPG sessions in front of me and was looking for new stuff to scare my players anyway. To anyone who´s already listened to it: Which former Young score would this one compare most to?


    YOU'LL LOVE IT!
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.