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      CommentAuthorErik Woods
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007
    Nautilus wrote
    I don't use to read the track descriptions from this kind of this kind of liner notes. Im more interested when they talk about the process of the music.....I still have to read the liner notes from Aliens and Total Recall andI have bought both deluxe editions.


    Well, you'd answer A LOT of your questions if you did.

    -Erik-
    host and producer of CINEMATIC SOUND RADIO | www.cinematicsound.net | www.facebook.com/cinematicsound | I HAVE TINNITUS!
    •  
      CommentAuthorNautilus
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007 edited
    Erik Woods wrote
    Nautilus wrote
    Erik Woods wrote

    If you are referring to Shore's action music from LOTR then you are way off. There is no way that Williamesque action music would have worked in LOTR. It's just not that type of movie. What Shore provide was EXACTLY what the film needed!

    -Erik-


    I never im agree with this kind of Arguments :" this music will not work here or there". Like when someone says something like "the prestige had the best music posible, something more thematic couldn't work here"
    It's not true! Always the music can be more thematic or more dinamic and works in the same way or even better!


    But it wouldn't have. Williams action style would have been out of place... however, if he did something more along the lines of War of the Worlds... maybe. What Shore did was spot on.

    -Erik-


    When I mean music like "star Wars" i talk more about the orchestrations and the rythm than about the tone, so The action music from LOTR can be dark, Agressive or Even Dissonant and be more rich and rythmic like Williams or Goldenthal.

    Maybe I can't explain it well.
    •  
      CommentAuthorNautilus
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007
    I have Watching fast Empire Strikes Back from my DVD and the Droids motif appears a lot of times!

    I miss some other motif? tongue
    •  
      CommentAuthorErik Woods
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007
    Nautilus wrote
    When I mean music like "star Wars" i talk about more about the orchestrations and the rythm that in the tone, so The action music from LOTR can be dark, Agressive or Even Dissonant and be more rich and rythmic like Williams or Goldenthal.

    Maybe I can't explain it well.


    But Star Wars music wouldn't have worked. I don't know how many times I can stress that to you. And Shore's music for LOTR is very rich and rhythmic. I mean, even though "Shelob's Lair" is an impressive action cue... and I think the type of action music you are looking for in the rest of Shore's score... it's the one cue that doesn't work in the film. It's far too jarring and out of place compared to the rest of the score. Jackson actually requested for something more Herrmannesque... and I kinda wish he didn't. It disrupts the flow of the score. It's the black sheep cue of the trilogy. It doesn't belong with the rest of the 9 -12 or how many hours of music Shore wrote for the three films.

    -Erik-
    host and producer of CINEMATIC SOUND RADIO | www.cinematicsound.net | www.facebook.com/cinematicsound | I HAVE TINNITUS!
    •  
      CommentAuthorErik Woods
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007
    Nautilus wrote
    I have Watching fast Empire Strikes Back from my DVD and the Droids motif appears a lot of times!

    I miss some other motif? tongue


    TAKE SOME TIME OUT OF YOUR DAY AND READ THE LINER NOTES!!!!!!!

    Expand your mind!!!

    -Erik-
    host and producer of CINEMATIC SOUND RADIO | www.cinematicsound.net | www.facebook.com/cinematicsound | I HAVE TINNITUS!
    •  
      CommentAuthorNautilus
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007 edited
    Erik Woods wrote
    Nautilus wrote
    When I mean music like "star Wars" i talk about more about the orchestrations and the rythm that in the tone, so The action music from LOTR can be dark, Agressive or Even Dissonant and be more rich and rythmic like Williams or Goldenthal.

    Maybe I can't explain it well.


    And Shore's music for LOTR is very rich and rhythmic. I mean, even though "Shelob's Lair" is an impressive action cue...

    -Erik-


    For sure Shelob's lair is by far my favourite action track from LOTR trilogy, And for my ears fits very well with the scene and the "Character". But Do you want another example about the kind of action music that I think it could be more dinamic and fits even better with the movie??

    "the breach Of the Deeping" from TTT complete recordings. What do you think? more dinamic, with drums, with more inflection points, more exiting and without loose the tone of the movie.
    •  
      CommentAuthorNautilus
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007
    Erik Woods wrote
    Nautilus wrote
    I have Watching fast Empire Strikes Back from my DVD and the Droids motif appears a lot of times!

    I miss some other motif? tongue


    TAKE SOME TIME OUT OF YOUR DAY AND READ THE LINER NOTES!!!!!!!

    Expand your mind!!!

    -Erik-


    Ok im doing it....Im reading ""the Wampa's Lair"...Oops! again the new droids motif on this track. shame
    •  
      CommentAuthorErik Woods
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007 edited
    Nautilus wrote
    "the breach Of the Deeping" from TTT complete recordings. What do you think? more dinamic, with drums, with more inflection points, more exiting and without loose the tone of the movie.


    I'd say that you are looking for something a little more Goldsmithian than Williams. Constant rhythms throughout the entire action cue a la First Knight. You know, I'd take a Goldsmith LOTR over a Williams LOTR.

    BTW, does that cue contain the swashbuckling music for Greenleaf's shield slide down the stairs?

    CHEESE BALL!!!

    -Erik-
    host and producer of CINEMATIC SOUND RADIO | www.cinematicsound.net | www.facebook.com/cinematicsound | I HAVE TINNITUS!
    •  
      CommentAuthorNautilus
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007 edited
    Erik Woods wrote
    Nautilus wrote
    "the breach Of the Deeping" from TTT complete recordings. What do you think? more dinamic, with drums, with more inflection points, more exiting and without loose the tone of the movie.


    I'd say that you are looking for something a little more Goldsmithian than Williams. Constant rhythms throughout the entire action cue a la First Knight. You know, I'd take a Goldsmith LOTR over a Williams LOTR.

    BTW, does that cue contain the swashbuckling music for Greenleaf's shield slide down the stairs?

    CHEESE BALL!!!

    -Erik-


    Yes! Do you not love it?? Why all this actual movies about sword and sorcery has so little scenes of Swashbucking??

    Dammed! I want to see action pieces like these!
    •  
      CommentAuthorErik Woods
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007
    Nautilus wrote
    Erik Woods wrote

    BTW, does that cue contain the swashbuckling music for Greenleaf's shield slide down the stairs?

    CHEESE BALL!!!

    -Erik-


    Yes! Do you not love it?? Why all this actual movies about sword and sorcery has so little scenes of Swashbucking??

    Dammed! I want to see action pieces like these!


    Hell no. What an AWFUL moment in the film. Totally out of place. The LOTR is not your typical sword and sorcery film. Don't you get it? That type of stuff is only a small portion of the greater story. You want playful swashbuckling... go play The Sea Hawk or Robin Hood. Those films are just what they are... the LOTR was something much bigger and far more dramatic, IMHO.

    -Erik-
    host and producer of CINEMATIC SOUND RADIO | www.cinematicsound.net | www.facebook.com/cinematicsound | I HAVE TINNITUS!
    •  
      CommentAuthorNautilus
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007 edited
    Erik Woods wrote
    Nautilus wrote
    Erik Woods wrote

    BTW, does that cue contain the swashbuckling music for Greenleaf's shield slide down the stairs?

    CHEESE BALL!!!

    -Erik-


    Yes! Do you not love it?? Why all this actual movies about sword and sorcery has so little scenes of Swashbucking??

    Dammed! I want to see action pieces like these!


    Don't you get it?

    -Erik-


    Yes, I get it. It's about a gang of gays that fight about his masculity trying to destroy one ring, the symbol of the marriage and the women. biggrin
    •  
      CommentAuthorMarselus
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007 edited
    Nautilus wrote

    Yes, I get it. It's about a gang of gays that fight about his masculity trying to destroy one ring, the symbol of the marriage and the women. biggrin


    biggrin It´s 3:50 AM Jordi, maybe time to go to sleep. But that gay thing, hmmm, I don´t think you´re wrong at all...
    Anything with an orchestra or with a choir....at some point will reach you
    •  
      CommentAuthorErik Woods
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007
    Nautilus wrote

    Yes, I get it. It's about a gang of gays that fight about his masculity trying to destroy one ring, the symbol of the marriage and the women. biggrin


    WHAT THE HELL?!?!?!

    -Erik-
    host and producer of CINEMATIC SOUND RADIO | www.cinematicsound.net | www.facebook.com/cinematicsound | I HAVE TINNITUS!
    •  
      CommentAuthorMarselus
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007
    Erik Woods wrote
    Nautilus wrote

    Yes, I get it. It's about a gang of gays that fight about his masculity trying to destroy one ring, the symbol of the marriage and the women. biggrin


    WHAT THE HELL?!?!?!

    -Erik-


    Hahaha....I insist, it´s 4:00 AM here in Spain.....
    Anything with an orchestra or with a choir....at some point will reach you
    •  
      CommentAuthorMartijn
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007
    Nautilus wrote
    Yes, I get it. It's about a gang of gays that fight about his masculity trying to destroy one ring, the symbol of the marriage and the women. biggrin


    biggrin

    That's the funniest analysis I've read since the evangelical broadcasting company in the Netherlands did one for Return Of the Jedi and came up with the summary that it showed it was "always good to say your prayers". biggrin
    'no passion nor excitement here, despite all the notes and musicians' ~ Falkirkbairn
    •  
      CommentAuthorNautilus
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007
    Martijn wrote
    Nautilus wrote
    Yes, I get it. It's about a gang of gays that fight about his masculity trying to destroy one ring, the symbol of the marriage and the women. biggrin


    biggrin

    That's the funniest analysis I've read since the evangelical broadcasting company in the Netherlands did one for Return Of the Jedi and came up with the summary that it showed it was "always good to say your prayers". biggrin


    cool

    Fool of me!!! Luke's theme in the main title theme, and the force theme is a theme aside!!!!

    Wow...Empire Is such a masterpiece! I could have been listening for years and discover things everyday....Why ZImmer can do this ? crazy
    • CommentAuthorTimmer
    • CommentTimeDec 1st 2007
    Martijn wrote
    Nautilus wrote
    Yes, I get it. It's about a gang of gays that fight about his masculity trying to destroy one ring, the symbol of the marriage and the women. biggrin


    biggrin

    That's the funniest analysis I've read since the evangelical broadcasting company in the Netherlands did one for Return Of the Jedi and came up with the summary that it showed it was "always good to say your prayers". biggrin



    I'm still laughing, that killed me punk biggrin

    Thanks Jordi beer
    On Friday I ate a lot of dust and appeared orange near the end of the day ~ Bregt
    • CommentAuthorMatt C
    • CommentTimeDec 2nd 2007
    I sincerely hope that Williams comes back to score Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows, or is at least involved with the music in some form. But it probably won't happen. sad

    And Jordi, please stop asking stupid questions. If you actually took the time to read Erik's posts and phrase your replies carefully, we'd all be a lot better off.
    http://unsungfilmscores.blogspot.com/ -- My film/TV/game score review blog
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      CommentAuthorScribe
    • CommentTimeDec 2nd 2007
    I heard that Williams wants to do Deathly Hallows if he can, can anyone confirm that?
    I love you all. Never change. Well, unless you want to!
    •  
      CommentAuthorDavid
    • CommentTimeDec 2nd 2007
    Scribe wrote
    I heard that Williams wants to do Deathly Hallows if he can, can anyone confirm that?


    After a lecture that Williams gave on the East Coast, a fan went up to him for an autograph. While getting whatever signed, he asked Williams if he would be back for Deathly Hollows, and Williams said he would like to score the final one.

    It wasn't said at the lecture and heard by the entire audience as some people and sites have reported. I'm sure the fan wasn't lying, but it was blown slightly out of proportion for a while.

    Personally, I'd love to have him back for the final film if he can get his action scoring under control (for those of you have read the book, you know it's got a hefty chunk of action). Williams is without a doubt one of my favorite composers and can craft a theme like no other, but his action material has been less than stellar lately. On top of that, I am one of the few who really enjoyed Hooper's score for the last film. If he does an even better job in Half-Blood Prince, I would have no qualms with keeping him for the final film.
    •  
      CommentAuthorErik Woods
    • CommentTimeDec 2nd 2007
    David wrote
    Williams is without a doubt one of my favorite composers and can craft a theme like no other, but his action material has been less than stellar lately.


    Less than steller? Since when? Because I was mightily impressed with the action cues from his last Harry Potter score, the opening battle sequence in Revenge of the Sith, The Chase Through Coruscant, and War of the Worlds contains some fresh and unique action scoring. Where's the problem?

    -Erik-
    host and producer of CINEMATIC SOUND RADIO | www.cinematicsound.net | www.facebook.com/cinematicsound | I HAVE TINNITUS!
    • CommentAuthorTimmer
    • CommentTimeDec 2nd 2007
    Erik Woods wrote
    David wrote
    Williams is without a doubt one of my favorite composers and can craft a theme like no other, but his action material has been less than stellar lately.


    Less than steller? Since when? Because I was mightily impressed with the action cues from his last Harry Potter score, the opening battle sequence in Revenge of the Sith, The Chase Through Coruscant, and War of the Worlds contains some fresh and unique action scoring. Where's the problem?

    -Erik-


    Agree, Williams has moved on, I can understand why some people may not like it....sort of?

    I love it!
    On Friday I ate a lot of dust and appeared orange near the end of the day ~ Bregt
    • CommentAuthorMatt C
    • CommentTimeDec 2nd 2007
    I heard that post on JWFan.net, but whoever is chosen to direct the final film will have a composer in mind. If Alfonso Cuaron is chosen, then I'm pretty confident that Williams will be back. Even though Cuaron was contractually obligated to use Williams for the third film, he was very pleased with the music (in the liner notes) and so he'll probably ask Williams back. Cuaron and Yates directed the two best HP films thus far, but if Yates helms the final installment we'll get Hooper back for his third HP score.
    http://unsungfilmscores.blogspot.com/ -- My film/TV/game score review blog
    •  
      CommentAuthorDavid
    • CommentTimeDec 2nd 2007 edited
    Erik Woods wrote
    David wrote
    Williams is without a doubt one of my favorite composers and can craft a theme like no other, but his action material has been less than stellar lately.


    Less than steller? Since when? Because I was mightily impressed with the action cues from his last Harry Potter score, the opening battle sequence in Revenge of the Sith, The Chase Through Coruscant, and War of the Worlds contains some fresh and unique action scoring. Where's the problem?

    -Erik-


    None of it's bad, I'm just not a huge fan of his more modern action writing (although I do very much enjoy "Quidditch, Third Year"). There's a lot of instruments coming in and out all the time and sometimes it's just a huge cacophony of sound. So much of it sounds overly complicated and not as thematic as he used to be. I don't enjoy comparing the new Williams sound to the old Williams sound, because I like them both for very different reasons.

    One of the things I loved about Hooper's score for Order of the Phoenix was the ridiculously simple action music. It gave the film a really interesting feeling, especially during the final battle when there were tiny spaces of silence and then the pace would pick up again. Williams' recent material has been so in your face, that I just don't enjoy it as much.

    EDIT: Good god, I need to proofread.
    •  
      CommentAuthorScribe
    • CommentTimeDec 2nd 2007
    Hooper's score was functional. I enjoy it as a score. I do NOT enjoy it as a score for Harry Potter. Williams could have done amazing things with Order of the Phoenix, and I will cry if he does Deathly Hallows.
    I love you all. Never change. Well, unless you want to!
    •  
      CommentAuthorDavid
    • CommentTimeDec 2nd 2007
    I know that I'm in the vast minority of those who did enjoy Hooper's score. To me it was a fresh take on the movie, and I don't care that much about thematic and aural continuity between the Potter films as I do other franchises. At one time I did, and would still like to see Williams' "Window to Time Past" theme make some kind of appearance, but mostly I'd like to hear interesting original ideas that mesh well with the film.
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      CommentAuthorScribe
    • CommentTimeDec 2nd 2007
    Oh, I do enjoy the score. I just have in my head all these ideas of how it COULD have been so much better and I have a really vivid imagination, which can be frustrating...
    I love you all. Never change. Well, unless you want to!
    •  
      CommentAuthorErik Woods
    • CommentTimeDec 2nd 2007
    David wrote

    One of the things I loved about Hooper's score of Order of the Phoenix was the ridiculously simple action music.


    I that's what I absolutely hated about Hooper's score. It was far too simple. It's easily the worst of the 5 Potter scores. Hopefully Hooper will inject a little more energy in his action writing for the next movie... but I'm not confident.

    -Erik-
    host and producer of CINEMATIC SOUND RADIO | www.cinematicsound.net | www.facebook.com/cinematicsound | I HAVE TINNITUS!
    •  
      CommentAuthorDavid
    • CommentTimeDec 2nd 2007 edited
    Erik Woods wrote
    David wrote

    One of the things I loved about Hooper's score of Order of the Phoenix was the ridiculously simple action music.


    I that's what I absolutely hated about Hooper's score. It was far too simple. It's easily the worst of the 5 Potter scores. Hopefully Hooper will inject a little more energy in his action writing for the next movie... but I'm not confident.

    -Erik-


    I'm going to go out on a limb here and prepare to be flogged, but I think Sorcerer's Stone could also be in the running for worst score.

    The themes are magnificent and Hooper can't hold a candle to them, but the underscore is often times so hokey and mickey mousey that it detracts from the film. I think part of that stems from the film being scored almost non-stop. A little better spotting would have gone a long way.

    I'm not going so far as to say it is the worst of the franchise, but I did feel the music detracted from the film at times when I never felt that with Hooper's score.

    [runs away and shields self from gunfire]
    •  
      CommentAuthorErik Woods
    • CommentTimeDec 2nd 2007
    Ooooh... PHILOSOPHER'S Stone is indeed the 2nd worst. Like you said, great themes but the film was over scored. But I'd still take that over Hooper's unimpressive effort!

    -Erik-
    host and producer of CINEMATIC SOUND RADIO | www.cinematicsound.net | www.facebook.com/cinematicsound | I HAVE TINNITUS!