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      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeMay 13th 2008 edited
    Ok, here's the deal.

    1) Respected reviewers are writing less and less reviews as months pass by, see moviemusicuk.us for one example.

    2) With the rapid spread of fast internet, piracy has been boosted to extreme levels (often helped by little bits of us all, even without realizing it) so everyone can now have ANY new score instantly at a click of the mouse and in just minutes.

    3) Record labels, partly influenced by the afore mentioned situation and also due to their own problems / changes of policies etc etc, have been sending less and less PROMO CDs lately and have been cutting them down to specific channels.

    Question is:

    Is it still worth it?


    Do people actually need the reviewers' opinions since they can preview the albums themselves, sometimes even before the reviewer does? Do people yet still RESPECT the reviewers’ opinions anymore? Do people actually care or do they just prefer listening to the albums themselves?

    Interested to hear your views, it's something that has been in my mind for long now, thus the lack of updates at my blog (despite the very warm acceptance of it as i started it) and i am sure many others are struggling with questions like this in their mind too.
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
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      CommentAuthorMartijn
    • CommentTimeMay 13th 2008
    Without any quips, the long and short of it is that to save myself a lot of time and grief, I nearly always read multiple reviews before I get any score in any way.

    These reviews can be grand, eloquent and convoluted or indeed just a single word from a trusted on-line friend ("GET this! It's GREAT!").

    And -obviously- I tend to put more stock in (even one-word) reviews from people I find I am much on par with as far as taste and preference goes.
    'no passion nor excitement here, despite all the notes and musicians' ~ Falkirkbairn
  1. hey, he's trying to take away our job biggrin

    No seriously, I don't care of reviews when I really want a score, but I care about reviews when I don't know exactly what I'm getting. And I especially care when I can get multiple takes on something I don't know off. So for me Reviews matter because they give me insight to something I don't know anything off.

    Plus, not all people get their scores through internet or labels, they have to actually spend money on it. And if I do that, it matters what I'm getting and then I'm grateful for every ounce of information I can get of it.
    waaaaaahhhhhhhh!!! Where's my nut? arrrghhhhhhh
    • CommentAuthorAnthony
    • CommentTimeMay 13th 2008
    I rarely look at reviews for scores that I'm not interested in already. Usually I'll only look at reviews of stuff I have or plan to get, just to see what someone else thinks of it (but not letting their opinion affect whether I get it or not).
    • CommentAuthorTimmer
    • CommentTimeMay 13th 2008
    A combination of Martijn and Anthony.

    I'm much more likely to take recommendations of people I know, particularly if their tastes in a particular composer is similar to mine.

    I don't buy "blind" very often anymore.
    On Friday I ate a lot of dust and appeared orange near the end of the day ~ Bregt
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      CommentAuthorBregt
    • CommentTimeMay 13th 2008
    I think MainTitles offers quite some new reviews, one almost every two days! Varous scores and releases, and I tink we do well. smile

    As for the subject, I agree with Martijn and Thomas. I mostly read the review when I have the score already. For older scores I never heard of or don't have soundclips from, I tend to first read some reviews and then decide based on those. I usually visit James' site and MovieMusicUK, although the latter has now been by random visits.

    Obviously, I read the maintitles.net reviews and mostly Tom's on GoldenScores. smile
    Kazoo
  2. Yes, especially if there are going to be more "Iron Man" reviews.
    The views and opinions of Ford A. Thaxton are his own and do not necessarily reflect the ones of ANYONE else.
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      CommentAuthorSouthall
    • CommentTimeMay 13th 2008
    I wouldn't say I am influenced in my purchasing decisions very often by reviews (most of what I buy is from Intrada and Varese limited editions, and nobody other than me ever reviews them anyway so I couldn't read reviews even if I wanted to) but I still enjoy reading them. I guess most useful is reviews of lesser-known stuff, but it's always interesting to read other people's opinions of the major releases. Of course one can get that from the forums, but there is a tendency in some people (on all internet forums, not just film music ones) to push their real opinion into a somewhat forced extreme one, just to try to make a point (how many things are either "wonderful" or "awful" in the Now Playing threads!?)
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      CommentAuthorMartijn
    • CommentTimeMay 13th 2008
    I never put my opinion forward as an extreme.
    Simply as Truth.
    'no passion nor excitement here, despite all the notes and musicians' ~ Falkirkbairn
  3. I think that reviewing scores and uploading them for people to read is still very important and needs to be kept going, though I think that what needs to be reviewed may need to change. Yes, people are able to sample scores from audio clips but a review can enlighten the reader on how the whole score fits together, highlighting things that short audio clips can't reveal.

    I would like to see a change of emphasis whereby reviewers review items that are less well known and where audio clips are lacking. Instead of trying to review quickly all the new CDs from blockbuster movies, provide a service to people who want to broaden their listening by providing guidance to the unfamiliar.

    I also like to read what other people think of a score that I have listened to and formed an opinion on. Varying opinions might highlight other angles in scores that you think you have sussed.

    The casual browser who has not much experience listening to film music and comes across a review of some music they heard whilst at the cinema is going to get more information (usually) reading a review here than, say, at Amazon. And - I may be wrong - but the environment where every score is available immediately at the click of a button is not the norm. And if it is then downloading every available score to listen to can't give each score the time and investment they deserve (at least for that first listen).

    Online reviews are very useful, but maybe reviewers need to think a bit more when it comes to choosing what to review.
    The views expressed in this post are entirely my own and do not reflect the opinions of maintitles.net, or for that matter, anyone else. http://www.racksandtags.com/falkirkbairn
  4. I value the reviews that are out there, even Clemmensen's. I wish I could write more, but in a sense I find when I'm not clear about something - usually a more historical score - I can gauge my own reaction by a Southall review. It's not hard to spot the dogs from a distance. On the other hand, seeing James rip into them like a bulldog is good fun anyway!

    The reviews I wouldn't mind seeing more of are reviews that attempt a bit more interpretation of the music and its role in the story. These are the type of reviews I try to write, and that's because I'm always so impressed by articles by Doug Adams (and others) that do the same.
    A butterfly thinks therefore I am
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      CommentAuthorSouthall
    • CommentTimeMay 14th 2008
    I agree with your last statement, Franz - I would dearly love to see more of that. There is definitely a gap in the market for such reviews - maybe there are some of them at FSM Online, I wouldn't know, but I don't think any of the free sites do it. Hopefully some day you (or someone of a similar mind and ability) might be able to start doing it more frequently.
  5. Southall wrote
    I agree with your last statement, Franz - I would dearly love to see more of that. There is definitely a gap in the market for such reviews - maybe there are some of them at FSM Online, I wouldn't know, but I don't think any of the free sites do it. Hopefully some day you (or someone of a similar mind and ability) might be able to start doing it more frequently.


    Yeah, as you know I tried to run a site like that for a while, but the workload of doing every review that way was a bit much. (I remember even taking a day off work at one point just to get through it all without working over several nights. It was at that point I started to wonder whether it was worth it.) I'd like to do a book of my own on the subject a few years down the track, when I have a bit more musical aptitude & film experience under the (sadly expanding) belt.

    FSM Online doesn't tend to have the reviews that really grab me. Cary, Steve Kennedy and others follow the formula for reviewing a bit more, and it's always the year-end editorials by the Kaplans, Bond and Adams that I log in for. Those have the right balance of information and personality. (And personality carrying from one review to another is important, which has benefited your site a lot. We'd all miss MovieWave greatly because we're interested to see how you express your opinion as much as whether you think it's worth buying or not.) Another consistently good but occasional FSM Online reviewer is Jillian Smith (I think that's her surname), who once excoriated me for a review THE LAST MIMZY.
    A butterfly thinks therefore I am
  6. franz_conrad wrote
    ...Jillian Smith (I think that's her surname), who once excoriated me for a review THE LAST MIMZY.

    Ouch!! shocked



    Sorry! I'm getting confused with "exfoliated". shame
    The views expressed in this post are entirely my own and do not reflect the opinions of maintitles.net, or for that matter, anyone else. http://www.racksandtags.com/falkirkbairn
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      CommentAuthorsdtom
    • CommentTimeMay 14th 2008
    A lot of very good points have been brought up. I just happened to have a conversation with Milan this morning and some of the very points were brought up. We were discussing the release of their new vinyl. Some of this was in direct response to the decline of CD sales along with a renewed interest in listening to LP's. For your information the first three releases are Gettysburg, Mulholland Drive, and Pan's Labyrinth with Spirted Away on the near horizon.

    I somewhat agree that the reviewer is being phased out in favor of sound clips. And I also agree that when I choose something like Mark Twain or Phillip Lambro (my last two reviews) there is indeed more interest probably because there is little other information out there about them. But then golden scores was specialized somewhat to begin with.

    I for one am planning on continuing as long as I am able to write and I think I do provide a service to SAE, John Morgan, and others in the industry that introduce material that is obscure.
    listen to more classical music!
  7. FalkirkBairn wrote
    franz_conrad wrote
    ...Jillian Smith (I think that's her surname), who once excoriated me for a review THE LAST MIMZY.

    Ouch!! shocked



    Sorry! I'm getting confused with "exfoliated". shame


    It still hurt! dizzy
    A butterfly thinks therefore I am
    • CommentAuthorPanthera
    • CommentTimeMay 15th 2008
    I like reviews. Its really helpful to read several of them. Much safer than going to www.amazon.com for reviews.
    • CommentAuthorTrekkinD
    • CommentTimeMay 15th 2008
    I still enjoy reading reviews. I'm trying to be more picky about what I buy and I find for me that the reviews help give me an idea of the whole score. I find that I can't get a good feel for the score by the low fidelity 30 second soundclips at many of the online stores. Most of the time, if it is at a non-film score based website, they always seem to pick the worst 30 seconds of a track. If a see a new review posted, I usually will at least take a glance and if the score is something I should look into more.
    • CommentAuthorTimmer
    • CommentTimeMay 15th 2008
    Martijn wrote
    I never put my opinion forward as an extreme.
    Simply as Truth.


    Bishop Desmond Tutu walked on water once, the next day headlines in South African papers exclaimed "Bishop Desmond Tutu CANNOT Swim".
    On Friday I ate a lot of dust and appeared orange near the end of the day ~ Bregt
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      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeMay 15th 2008
    Thanks for the input so far, deeply appreciated. Seeing the discussions about the promos album being sent only within US and such, and having experienced such cut-offs myself as well during the last couple of years, I'd really like more input from reviewers themselves. 'Cause it's logical that they experience the subject matter different that film music fans who are awaiting for those reviews to be written and published. Both views are very useful, but very different at the same time.
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
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      CommentAuthorsdtom
    • CommentTimeMay 16th 2008
    Especially with some of the older material the question arises which recording? I can afford to buy one do I get I the John Morgan reconstructed King Kong or get the OST.
    listen to more classical music!
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      CommentAuthorMartijn
    • CommentTimeMay 16th 2008
    That's a good point, Tom.
    Especially when at times I happen to enjoy a particular rerecording over the OST (such as in the case of the McNeely recording of The Day The Earth Stood Still or conversely the original version over the rerecording (such as Rozsa's El Cid)

    Doesn't make a reviewer's job any easier, I'd guess...
    'no passion nor excitement here, despite all the notes and musicians' ~ Falkirkbairn
    • CommentAuthorJoep
    • CommentTimeMay 16th 2008 edited
    franz_conrad wrote
    The reviews I wouldn't mind seeing more of are reviews that attempt a bit more interpretation of the music and its role in the story.


    This a reason why I don't like a lot of reviews. Most of them are just description of how tracks sound, what instruments are being used. I don't mind that really, but most of the times these are very long reviews. Then I browse through them really fast trying to find what the score sounds like in general.
    • CommentAuthorJoep
    • CommentTimeMay 16th 2008 edited
    Christodoulides wrote
    2) With the rapid spread of fast internet, piracy has been boosted to extreme levels (often helped by little bits of us all, even without realizing it) so everyone can now have ANY new score instantly at a click of the mouse and in just minutes.


    This brings us to the question; does a review need to tell you what it is in order for you to purchase it? For probably most people this is a reason to read them, or to see if these writers share their opinion. I like reading those that tell you something about the score process, some nice trivia, relation film-score and naturally something about how it sounds. Perhaps I'm seeking something a little bit different than most people. I often find myself browsing through reviews, searching for those few things I want to know. I'd rather see a description of the overall score with some small examples, instead of a lot of details of tracks for example. This may sound negative, but I still think reviews are still worth it, just not always for me.

    (sorry for repeating myself wink )
  8. Joep wrote
    franz_conrad wrote
    The reviews I wouldn't mind seeing more of are reviews that attempt a bit more interpretation of the music and its role in the story.


    This a reason why I don't like a lot of reviews. Most of them are just description of how tracks sound, what instruments are being used. I don't mind that really, but most of the times these are very long reviews. Then I browse through them really fast trying to find what the score sounds like in general.


    uh oh, he's referring to me biggrin
    waaaaaahhhhhhhh!!! Where's my nut? arrrghhhhhhh
    • CommentAuthorJoep
    • CommentTimeMay 17th 2008
    Actually to nobody in particular...
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      CommentAuthorBhelPuri
    • CommentTimeMay 17th 2008 edited
    NO NO NO! I just got done with my semester, saw this thread and was about to make a post but it logged me out when I tried to submit. And now I lost everything sad crazy

    Yay! Turns out that it gets me the text if I go back to the page after logging in. What a smart website!

    Lots of interesting comments here. What Alan said earlier (excellent post, dude!) quite sums up my view-

    FalkirkBairn wrote
    I think that reviewing scores and uploading them for people to read is still very important and needs to be kept going, though I think that what needs to be reviewed may need to change. Yes, people are able to sample scores from audio clips but a review can enlighten the reader on how the whole score fits together, highlighting things that short audio clips can't reveal.

    I would like to see a change of emphasis whereby reviewers review items that are less well known and where audio clips are lacking. Instead of trying to review quickly all the new CDs from blockbuster movies, provide a service to people who want to broaden their listening by providing guidance to the unfamiliar.


    I don't look for much from reviews of the mainstream scores aside from a brief mention of which cues are good and why. Then around the end of the month when the scores are available for listening, I check them out at SST and decide for myself whether I need to get it or not. I try to stay away from buying regular (mainstream) releases as much as possible. They can always be bought for cheap from Amazon-used some months later.

    I do like to explore the lesser-known scores and that's an area where I'd like to see reviews that describe something more about the music (what's happening 'musically', how it works in the film). Or even a brief note of exciting finds will do.

    Too many reviews out there look like the writers were following a rule book in describing it. Very generic and no sense of individuality. Which is why Southall's reviews are a favorite-- his unique way of saying it plus the fact that they're so friggin' entertaining! (BTW James, you need to resurrect the old reviews which you said you had lost. You know you can retrieve the text from web archive, right?)
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      CommentAuthorSouthall
    • CommentTimeMay 17th 2008
    BhelPuri wrote
    (BTW James, you need to resurrect the old reviews which you said you had lost. You know you can retrieve the text from web archive, right?)


    I know, and I was going to use it... but then I read them. Most of them are pretty awful and would need re-writing.
  9. BhelPuri wrote
    I do like to explore the lesser-known scores and that's an area where I'd like to see reviews that describe something more about the music (what's happening 'musically', how it works in the film). Or even a brief note of exciting finds will do.

    One of the problems of the lesser known scores is that they could be from movies that are difficult to view.

    Does anyone think that there's any use of reviewing promotional CDs? Are reviews of these CDs actually useful for the composers? (I do notice that some composers do link to reviews of these promo CDs.)
    The views expressed in this post are entirely my own and do not reflect the opinions of maintitles.net, or for that matter, anyone else. http://www.racksandtags.com/falkirkbairn
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      CommentAuthorDemonStar
    • CommentTimeMay 17th 2008
    FalkirkBairn wrote
    BhelPuri wrote
    I do like to explore the lesser-known scores and that's an area where I'd like to see reviews that describe something more about the music (what's happening 'musically', how it works in the film). Or even a brief note of exciting finds will do.

    One of the problems of the lesser known scores is that they could be from movies that are difficult to view.

    Does anyone think that there's any use of reviewing promotional CDs? Are reviews of these CDs actually useful for the composers? (I do notice that some composers do link to reviews of these promo CDs.)


    If they contain new material other than the OST, I'd say yes. It might help the Records see if the score's popular wink