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      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeOct 10th 2017
    Southall said it all in his review:


    Perhaps if Zimmer had had the time he no doubt would have loved to have had to throw everything of himself into this, we’d have got something special: it really does seem like the perfect sort of film for a completely turned-on, creative Hans Zimmer to immerse himself into. (...) I’ve never been convinced that the original Blade Runner score works quite as well outside the film as within it, but it’s undoubtedly one of the greatest electronic film scores (quite possibly the best of the lot) – there’s far less going on in this rather bland follow-up.


    btw , for this sound and sound-scape, Lorne Balfe's and Clint Mansell score for Ghost in the shell is much , much better and overlooked.
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
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      CommentAuthorThor
    • CommentTimeOct 10th 2017 edited
    Do you follow contemporary film music at all, D, post-IFMCA?

    There have been a number of good scores this year: THELMA (Ola Fløttum), TULIP FEVER (Danny Elfman), THE EMOJI MOVIE (Patrick Doyle), DUCKWEED (Peng Fei), LOUISE EN HIVER (Pascal Le Pennec), 2:22 (Lisa Gerrard and James Orr), PASSAGE TO DAWN (Diego Navarro), THE CIRCLE (Danny Elfman), THE PROMISE (Gabriel Yared), BRIMSTONE (Junkie XL), ALIEN: COVENANT (Jed Kurzel), LE COEUR EN BRAILLE (Philippe Jakko), THEIR FINEST (Rachel Portman), AERIAL CHINA (Bei Wang), VICEROY'S HOUSE (A.R. Rahman), SAATOKEIKKA (Pessi Levanto) and DESYNC (Daniel Deluxe) are all scores that have made it to my iTunes collection, and hence good scores. And varied in style!

    Just because you were disappointed in DUNKIRK and BLADE RUNNER (both of which I enjoy on some level, btw) doesn't mean it's all been like that.
    I am extremely serious.
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      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeOct 10th 2017 edited
    i heard 80% of what you wrote, thank God for movie-watching and spotify cause you know whoever heard of listening to modern film music anywhere else besides ifmca? wink wink and liked 3-4 scores. Not the elfmans, hated the Gerrard, the promise is gorgeous, alien is very very weak, their finest is standard portman, etc etc, but nothing truly big and good this year so far. All the major film scoring (holly blockbusters) trends in 2017 are severely disappointing and you will see them establishing themselves further in the years to come. You can be sure about it.
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
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      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeOct 10th 2017
    And it's funny because you didn't like the one and only truly great score of 2017 so far: giacchino apes score. Now that's the brightest and only exception in a mediocre year so far.
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
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      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeOct 10th 2017 edited
    And it's not the films themselves merely, the biggest disappointment are those trends. People like Johannsson being tossed for the same bassy drone sound design zimmer now wants to push around as music.
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
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      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeOct 10th 2017
    plus do you really think those obscure scores and composers you mentioned are representative of contemporary film music or people outside ifmca actually know them?
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
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      CommentAuthorThor
    • CommentTimeOct 10th 2017 edited
    Demetris wrote
    plus do you really think those obscure scores and composers you mentioned are representative of contemporary film music or people outside ifmca actually know them?


    Yes, they are representative. There's more to film music than Hollywood, after all. Doesn't really matter if only a few people have heard them; they're there for the taking.

    As for the rest, we'll just have to agree to disagree. Glad we have at least ONE common score that we liked this year (THE PROMISE).
    I am extremely serious.
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      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeOct 10th 2017
    Thor nobody outside ifmca knows half of the stuff you wrote i can guarantee you wink apart hipster film music there's the standard commercial film music everyone can listen to and it mostly sucks in 2017 wink
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
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      CommentAuthorThor
    • CommentTimeOct 10th 2017
    Does it really matter how many people listen to it, or are even aware of it? The point is that it EXISTS, and is there ready to be taken for those willing to explore beyond Hollywood.
    I am extremely serious.
  1. I think the point D is trying to make is that all of those scores you listed put together won't have 5% of the influence on Hollywood film scoring trends going forward that Dunkirk and Blade Runner 2049 will. So when people say film music, at least of the mainstream blockbuster variety, is creatively bankrupt or "in trouble" or all those things, listing a bunch of semi-obscure drama or foreign scores isn't going to do much to change their minds. Of course you're right, but it's not an argument that carries much weight.

    Incidentally I think all this "film music is doomed" stuff is pretty overblown, sure there are trends that I don't much care for but at the same time the two most successful film franchises currently running, Star Wars and the MCU, both adhere to a thematic orchestral film scoring idiom. Yes, the MCU music varies in quality a bit and none of it is for the ages, but 90% of Marvel scores are of the sort that film music fans tend to classify as "good".
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      CommentAuthorThor
    • CommentTimeOct 11th 2017 edited
    Edmund Meinerts wrote
    Incidentally I think all this "film music is doomed" stuff is pretty overblown


    I think so too.

    My issue with D's statement was the notion that somehow interesting film music doesn't "exist anymore", the type of sweeping generalization that only takes its point-of-departure in mainstream Hollywood film music, and hence a logical fallacy.

    But even if I were just to limit to big blockbusters, there's plenty of interesting variety to be found there as well.

    So if we were to omit DUNKIRK and BLADE RUNNER 2049 (both of which I liked on some level), there's still good things to be found among the "big stuff" in 2017: BEAUTY AND THE BEAST (OK, mostly new versions of the 1991 score), LOGAN, IT, GHOST IN THE SHELL, TRANSFORMERS: THE LAST KNIGHT, THE DARK TOWER. And some of those I mentioned in the earlier post.

    My issue with most of this criticism is that it focusses almost EXCLUSIVELY on a particular sub trend (mostly the action-oriented ostinato/RC style in mainstream genre movies), and then from that, draws the conclusion that "everything sucks these days". How about just evaluating a score on its own terms?

    Also, sometimes trends appear from smaller scores or "sleeper hits"; they don't always have to be big blockbusters to set an agenda.
    I am extremely serious.
  2. Given that list, we clearly have rather different ideas of what constitutes "good things". Of those, Beauty and the Beast is the only one I fully enjoyed. But what else is new. wink
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      CommentAuthorBobdH
    • CommentTimeOct 11th 2017 edited
    Thor wrote
    So if we were to omit DUNKIRK and BLADE RUNNER 2049 (both of which I liked on some level), there's still good things to be found among the "big stuff" in 2017: BEAUTY AND THE BEAST (OK, mostly new versions of the 1991 score), LOGAN, IT, GHOST IN THE SHELL, TRANSFORMERS: THE LAST KNIGHT, THE DARK TOWER. And some of those I mentioned in the earlier post.


    That might not be the best list to convince Demetris, I’d say War for the Planet of the Apes and what Giacchino’s doing in general, Daniel Pemberton’s King Arthur and his career, and then there’s Desplat, or Brian Tyler’s big thematic orchestral works for the Fast and Furious films or recently The Mummy, and the scores for Disney like Debney’s Jungle Book. Or Danny Elfman replacing Junkie XL on Justice League. I know you, Thor, don’t like most of these, and maybe not all of these succeeded to the same extend in terms of quality, but combined with the MCU scores they all show that there’s still room in Hollywood for scores that adhere to themes and orchestra and negate the whole “film scoring is dead” cliche of factless negativity.
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      CommentAuthorThor
    • CommentTimeOct 11th 2017 edited
    BobdH wrote
    That might not be the best list to convince Demetris, I’d say War for the Planet of the Apes and what Giacchino’s doing in general, Daniel Pemberton’s King Arthur and his career, and then there’s Desplat, or Brian Tyler’s big thematic orchestral works for the Fast and Furious films or recently The Mummy, and the scores for Disney like Debney’s Jungle Book. Or Danny Elfman replacing Junkie XL on Justice League. I know you, Thor, don’t like most of these, and maybe not all of these succeeded to the same extend in terms of quality, but combined with the MCU scores they all show that there’s still room in Hollywood for scores that adhere to themes and orchestra and negate the whole “film scoring is dead” cliche of factless negativity.


    True, we evaluate things differently, and I could not -- in good conscience -- recommend most of those. But the fact that we both have some good things to say about various big Hollywood scores in the last two years, shows, at least, a different attitude. Also, as you say, the titles we've mentioned not only showcase the existence of 'themes and orchestra', but also a wide scope of styles. A varied landscape.
    I am extremely serious.
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      CommentAuthorSouthall
    • CommentTimeOct 11th 2017
    As a wise man once said - you can't polish a turd, but you can put it in an envelope and send it to Michel Platini.
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      CommentAuthorThor
    • CommentTimeOct 15th 2017
    Curious:

    Has anyone managed to make a good playlist out of BLADE RUNNER that emphasizes the Vangelis-type stuff?

    (and please, no wisecracks from those who hate the score).
    I am extremely serious.
  3. Will try as soon as I delve into the score a lot more now, as I have to write my review. I hope I'll also make time to actually rewatch the original film. Due to other obligations I couldn't do that before 2049.
    http://www.filmmusic.pl - Polish Film Music Review Website
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      CommentAuthorThor
    • CommentTimeOct 15th 2017
    OK, great. I'll try to make my own too.

    I've seen 2049 twice now, and I'm afraid my reservations from the first viewing were cemented. It has some great values, but also some severe issues that prevent it from being what it could have been.
    I am extremely serious.
  4. I wonder how much better it would be if it wasn't just called Blade Runner. If they even made the references they made, even gave Ford a role, but not actually use that universe.

    I'm enamored with the film on a formal level.
    http://www.filmmusic.pl - Polish Film Music Review Website
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      CommentAuthorBobdH
    • CommentTimeOct 15th 2017
    PawelStroinski wrote
    I wonder how much better it would be if it wasn't just called Blade Runner. If they even made the references they made, even gave Ford a role, but not actually use that universe.

    I'm enamored with the film on a formal level.


    Could you be more specific on what you mean with that? Because you’re ok with the references towards the original, also the part of Ford, but not the fact it’s the same universe?

    I think I’m with you on this... to an extend and depending on what you meant. I love the references towards the original on the atmospheric and design level, but I was perfectly happy with the first two hours of the film centering around Gosling’s character and did not need Deckard in it. I was even dreading his entrance. Ultimately it was nicely done, but I wouldn’t have minded if the sequel were strictly about K. Deckard’s inclusion felt a bit like fan service.
  5. I mean, if they just made a film featuring the visual references to the original Blade Runner and even had a part for Harrison Ford (I would actually wonder how he would handle a character like the one Jared Leto played or have him instead of Robin Wright), that'd be brilliant.

    The problem is that it will be always compared to the original (and no, I don't think it's better as some reviewers do) and its thematic sensibilities. If it was planned as a standalone, without the shoulders of a beloved classics on it, I think it would benefit philosophically and definitely in terms of general perception.

    Deckard was an organic part of the story, but the seeds of his appearance could have perhaps been planted better (both more often and more subtly) earlier.

    What I really love about the film is that it's so meditative. My favorite films this year are this one, Scorsese's Silence and Jarmusch's Paterson, I think!
    http://www.filmmusic.pl - Polish Film Music Review Website
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      CommentAuthorThor
    • CommentTimeOct 18th 2017
    OK, I've made this 53-minute playlist of the BR soundtrack:

    1. 2049
    2. Sapper's Tree
    3. Rain
    4. Sea Wall
    5. Memory
    6. Mesa
    7. Joi
    8. Wallace
    9. That's Why We Believe
    10. All the Best Memories are Hers
    11. Blade Runner
    12. Almost Human

    In addition to removing some tracks, I've also rearranged the sequence slightly to allow for better listening. That is, I've kept "Mesa" (as the best track) midway. I've put "Sea Wall" and "Wallace" as 4 and 8, to break up the Vangelis vibes slightly. While the long, 10-minute "Blade Runner" contains segments I'm not too fond of, it also works as an end credits suite of sorts.

    I think this will work for me for now.
    I am extremely serious.
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      CommentAuthorBobdH
    • CommentTimeOct 18th 2017 edited
    You kept Almost Human? Don’t you find that song horribly out of sync with the score, and not fitting for the film at all? (It also probably didn’t help the singer/songwriter hadn’t seen the film before creating the song). It was the first thing I deleted.

    Interesting list by the way, might give it a try, but right now I’m quite happy with the presentation and don’t find it too long at all.
  6. Having seen the film, I do NOT remember the song at all. It's in one of the shorts.
    http://www.filmmusic.pl - Polish Film Music Review Website
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      CommentAuthorBobdH
    • CommentTimeOct 18th 2017
    I know it’s not in the film itself, of which I was incredibly relieved, but thought it was created for commercial album reasons. Is it in the shorts? Just realized I haven’t seen them all yet, but that would’ve been an awful decision of that director.
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      CommentAuthorThor
    • CommentTimeOct 18th 2017
    I actually like the song, although I agree it's a bit at odds with the rest of the score.
    I am extremely serious.
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      CommentAuthorSouthall
    • CommentTimeNov 12th 2017