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      CommentAuthorSteven
    • CommentTimeJul 16th 2009 edited
    I frackin' love it! It's pure escapism for me, more so than music at times. I certainly don't profess to be an expert, all I do is read a few books... but I trudge though regardless and hopefully eventually get to a point where I understand just enough about a given theory to see its implications (which really is the punchline of any good popular science book).
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      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeJul 16th 2009
    dizzy spin
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
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      CommentAuthorSteven
    • CommentTimeJul 16th 2009
    Christodoulides wrote
    dizzy spin


    Yeah, you and me both buddy. Trust me! dizzy
    • CommentAuthorTimmer
    • CommentTimeJul 16th 2009
    Steven wrote
    I frackin' love it! It's pure escapism for me, more so than music at times. I certainly don't profess to be an expert, all I do is read a few books... but I trudge though regardless and hopefully eventually get to a point where I understand just enough about a given theory to see its implications (which really is the punchline of any good popular science book).


    I have an idea for you which you'll forget or I'll remember......
    On Friday I ate a lot of dust and appeared orange near the end of the day ~ Bregt
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      CommentAuthorMartijn
    • CommentTimeJul 16th 2009
    uhm
    Steven, has Sagan anything to say on people challenging the linearity of time?
    'no passion nor excitement here, despite all the notes and musicians' ~ Falkirkbairn
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      CommentAuthorBregje
    • CommentTimeJul 16th 2009
    Steven, are you perhaps also interested in epistemology?
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      CommentAuthorMartijn
    • CommentTimeJul 16th 2009 edited
    biggrin I just had the most fascinating discussion on the subject: Knowledge Management is a staple of (mainly) IT companies...and one that's been baffling them for years (leading, unfortunately, to a serious slump in its perpetration): the main cause, I found out, is that so very few people have an actual inkling how to manage knowledge, and that goes directly back to not being able to define knowledge or to understand (or come to an agreement) what makes knowledge knowledge, and how it's acquired.

    In practice what happens is that basically just reams and reams of paper get saved, that nobody ever looks at. slant A little insight in epistemology wouldn't go amiss at all in many companies.
    'no passion nor excitement here, despite all the notes and musicians' ~ Falkirkbairn
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      CommentAuthorBregje
    • CommentTimeJul 16th 2009
    I don't think I understand the link between IT management and epistemology well...

    The only thing I can think of is "Is this laptop really in front of me or not? And how could I know?"
    wink
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      CommentAuthorMartijn
    • CommentTimeJul 16th 2009 edited
    lol

    It's not IT management.
    It's knowledge management.
    It's all about how to capture, organize and perpetrate acquired knowledge (and knowledge to be acquired). But to do that, obviously you need to know what knowledge is.

    I.T. isn't just about wires and buttons and stuff: it's information technology: it's all about making information available and knowledge accessible. And to do that most efficiently and effectively, you need to understand what knowledge and information are, how it is acquired, and how it is transferred.

    That's where epistemology comes in.
    To be able to make the proper information and knowledge available (both externally, to -say- a customer, as a product, as well as internally in processes and structures), you need to know what it is you want to know (and how you know it). How could anyone hope to do proper knowledge management if the very nature of knowledge escapes them? (That's why I said that -unfortunately- most knowledge management initiatives end up just being repositories of experience: process papers, analyses, reports on best practises, et cetera)

    Obviously knowledge management isn't limited to the IT sector. It's just the one I have most experience in, and the one where -arguably- the need for it is greatest.
    'no passion nor excitement here, despite all the notes and musicians' ~ Falkirkbairn
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      CommentAuthorMartijn
    • CommentTimeJul 16th 2009
    ...and I haven't even had coffee yet! dizzy
    'no passion nor excitement here, despite all the notes and musicians' ~ Falkirkbairn
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      CommentAuthorDemetris
    • CommentTimeJul 16th 2009
    And i already had 1 panadol cause of you not having had a coffee yet.
    Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders.
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      CommentAuthorMartijn
    • CommentTimeJul 16th 2009
    To give an example (which maybe was what you were looking for from me in the first place?): it's obvious that a company that employs a number of highly educated/trained professionals has a huge (professional) knowledge repository.

    The question is management would / should be asking itself is: how can this knowledge be captured?
    The follow-up questions -which generally are skipped over because they are too complicated to answer- are: WHAT is this knowledge (how is it defined)? HOW can we compartemantalize it, and make it tangible? Does EVERY instance of knowledge need to be captured, and if not, what determines the cut-off? And how do we KNOW what we know (i.e. how is importance and relevance measured: *I* may think I know why I know, but what happens if I'm challenged? Am I able to explain and transfer that information?).

    At that level, management generally gives up and goes for a three martini lunch. lick
    'no passion nor excitement here, despite all the notes and musicians' ~ Falkirkbairn
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      CommentAuthorMartijn
    • CommentTimeJul 16th 2009 edited
    Christodoulides wrote
    And i already had 1 panadol cause of you not having had a coffee yet.


    Sorry, D.
    shame
    I'll break for a three-martini early lunch.
    shame

    I don't think I did a very good job explaining anyway. sad


    (Aside from the fact we're going insanely off-topic, and Timmer is gonna kill me for ruining what actually is a really great thread (with a really bad title))
    'no passion nor excitement here, despite all the notes and musicians' ~ Falkirkbairn
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      CommentAuthorBregje
    • CommentTimeJul 16th 2009
    Hmm, I really don't understand much of management and efficiency in companies. Unless it's much like efficiency in education for instance. I'm sure there must be some similarities. Economic life and business are really not my thing.

    I really wonder what Steven thinks of epistemology. For me it changed a lot about how I look at science. Right now I'm reading something related to this as well by the way, Sight Unseen, the letters between Bryan Magee and the blind philosopher Martin Milligan.
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      CommentAuthorMartijn
    • CommentTimeJul 16th 2009
    So anyway, back on-topic.
    I guess everyone has these songs or tracks of pieces of music that they associate with events and people in the past. Sometimes, obviously, these are less happy events (illness, a lost love, that sort of thing), and once said music comes on, you are reminded of that situation.

    However, do you actually also avoid such music? To maybe avoid that memory and its associated emotions?

    To me music is the second strongest emotional trigger (as with many people, the sense of smell is number one). I'm slightly embarrassed to confess there are pieces of music -both good, which is a shame, AND bad- I avoid.

    I'll follow up with an example later.
    I was just wondering if this was something people recognised, or not at all?
    'no passion nor excitement here, despite all the notes and musicians' ~ Falkirkbairn
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      CommentAuthorMartijn
    • CommentTimeJul 16th 2009 edited
    Bregje wrote
    Hmm, I really don't understand much of management and efficiency in companies.

    Like I said, it's really not about management proper: it's about knowledge (and by extension, that's indeed true, how to manage knowledge). For myself, I am fascinated by the practical application of philosophy, but that's another topic altogether from what you're asking Steven, I guess, which seems to have a lot more to do with a personal appreciation and evaluation of (learning) knowledge. So never mind. smile
    Didn't want to dilute your question. Sorry!
    'no passion nor excitement here, despite all the notes and musicians' ~ Falkirkbairn
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      CommentAuthorBregt
    • CommentTimeJul 16th 2009 edited
    You all made my early morning. biggrin
    Kazoo
    • CommentAuthorTimmer
    • CommentTimeJul 16th 2009
    My thread has become fascinating ( don't blame me for the thread title, blame Steven tongue wink ).

    Well written Martijn and I understood it but if you asked me to regurgitate it in a minutes time I'd be fucked. dizzy
    On Friday I ate a lot of dust and appeared orange near the end of the day ~ Bregt
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      CommentAuthorsdtom
    • CommentTimeJul 16th 2009
    When I think about my first classical concert I recall Peter and the Wolf.
    listen to more classical music!
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      CommentAuthorSteven
    • CommentTimeJul 16th 2009
    Bregje wrote
    Steven, are you perhaps also interested in epistemology?


    Unavoidable if you're as anti-religious as I am.
  1. I am more interested in ethics and aesthetics myself smile

    Though philosophy is VERRRRY interesting.
    http://www.filmmusic.pl - Polish Film Music Review Website
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      CommentAuthorMartijn
    • CommentTimeJul 16th 2009
    Steven wrote
    Bregje wrote
    Steven, are you perhaps also interested in epistemology?

    Unavoidable if you're as anti-religious as I am.

    You'd be surprised how many religious aspects and elements return in certain schools of thought within epistemology... wink
    'no passion nor excitement here, despite all the notes and musicians' ~ Falkirkbairn
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      CommentAuthorBregje
    • CommentTimeJul 17th 2009
    Steven wrote
    Bregje wrote
    Steven, are you perhaps also interested in epistemology?


    Unavoidable if you're as anti-religious as I am.


    Funny you say that. Epistemology made me less anti-religious and it put science more in a relative context.

    Too bad we didn't start this in the humanoria topic... we could still do that.
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      CommentAuthorBregje
    • CommentTimeJul 17th 2009
    Martijn wrote
    Steven wrote
    Bregje wrote
    Steven, are you perhaps also interested in epistemology?

    Unavoidable if you're as anti-religious as I am.

    You'd be surprised how many religious aspects and elements return in certain schools of thought within epistemology... wink

    Yeah, like phenomenology!
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      CommentAuthorBregje
    • CommentTimeJul 17th 2009 edited
    PawelStroinski wrote
    I am more interested in ethics and aesthetics myself smile

    Though philosophy is VERRRRY interesting.

    Yes it is. I like how it contains all aspects of life. As a life view teacher there is a lot of emphasis on ethics and aesthetics. But also metaphysics and ontology when you're studying religion and just nature of existance. And, compared to some of my colleagues, I am very rational. I would like to study logic as well. I took Russell's barber paradox to school with me and the Cretenzer paradox by Epimenides, to see how 11-12 year olds would respond to it. It was a lot of fun. Some smart asses in that group for sure.
    dizzy

    You know, some people think philosophy is a supportive science to other sciences. And some think it is the mother of all sciences. And some say it's somewhere between science and theology. I really like the 'uiteindelijkheidsoptiek' (?) of it, opposed to just one aspect of life, like in science.

    To go back on topic (sorry), I really try to play music that triggers something, because most of my music does nothing for me lately unfortunately... it's time for something new! I think I should watch more movies perhaps. That's how my film music thing started, as something that connected to the movie.
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      CommentAuthorSunil
    • CommentTimeJul 17th 2009
    Christodoulides wrote
    dizzy spin


    biggrin
    Racism, Prejudices and discrimination exists everywhere.
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      CommentAuthorMartijn
    • CommentTimeJul 17th 2009
    rolleyes
    'no passion nor excitement here, despite all the notes and musicians' ~ Falkirkbairn
  2. face-palm-mt
    http://www.filmmusic.pl - Polish Film Music Review Website
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      CommentAuthorMartijn
    • CommentTimeJul 17th 2009
    Bregje wrote
    To go back on topic (sorry), I really try to play music that triggers something, because most of my music does nothing for me lately unfortunately...

    shocked
    Gladiator? Conan? Time Machine? Chicken Run? Fire?

    NOTHING?
    shocked
    sad

    it's time for something new! I think I should watch more movies perhaps.

    Or maybe even completely different types of music?
    Some classical? World music?
    Heavy metal? punk
    'no passion nor excitement here, despite all the notes and musicians' ~ Falkirkbairn
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      CommentAuthorSunil
    • CommentTimeJul 17th 2009
    Martijn wrote
    rolleyes


    confused
    Racism, Prejudices and discrimination exists everywhere.