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[Closed] Now Playing XLVII
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- CommentTimeApr 9th 2015 edited
Ralph Kruhm wrote
Can you please share your current playlist with us, Martijn? I'd love to hear your version.
Just took out all ambient cues and just a few non-ambient ones.
This really works for me:
1. The Seeding - Geoff Knorr
2. The Lush Planet- Geoff Knorr
3. Beauty In The Eye Of The Orbiter- Geoff Knorr
4. Destroyer - Geoff Knorr
5. Lux Perpetua - Geoff Knorr
6. Benedicite - Geoff Knorr
7. Our New World - Geoff Knorr
8. The Fungal Planet - Geoff Knorr
9. Acclimation - Geoff Knorr
10. Promethean - Geoff Knorr
11. Xenomalleum - Geoff Knorr
12. A New Beginning - Geoff Knorr
13. The Arid Planet - Michael Curran
14. Solar Collector - Grant Kirkhope
15. The Signal - Grant Kirkhope
16. Deep Memory - Grant Kirkhope
17. Planetfall - Michael Curran
18. Alien Shores - Michael Curran
19. Sky Mine - Michael Curran
20. Earth’s Ambassadors - Michael Curran
21. O Muse - Michael Curran
22. Deep Space - Michael Curran
23. Xenomancer - Michael Curran
24. Solid State Citizen - Griffin Cohen
25. The Future Of Mankind - Geoff Knorr'no passion nor excitement here, despite all the notes and musicians' ~ Falkirkbairn -
- CommentTimeApr 9th 2015
Steven wrote
still, I struggle to hear what all the fuss is about this score.
I thought this would be right up your alley. Tons of bombasticism!I am extremely serious. -
- CommentTimeApr 9th 2015
I find myself profoundly bored by it all, with the exception of the two cello-heavy tracks by Knorr. It's like trailer music in being an endless brutal assault on one's auditory senses and emotions, except it's not even as varied as a good trailer music album. I recognize that it's good music but somehow it was just exhausting to listen to.I love you all. Never change. Well, unless you want to! -
- CommentTimeApr 9th 2015
Thor wrote
Steven wrote
still, I struggle to hear what all the fuss is about this score.
I thought this would be right up your alley. Tons of bombasticism!
Yes, bombast. -
- CommentTimeApr 9th 2015
Bombastics? For Steven? Naaah. He's our resident Zen hippy whalehugging peace-minimalist soundscape trip-hop ambientalist.'no passion nor excitement here, despite all the notes and musicians' ~ Falkirkbairn -
- CommentTimeApr 9th 2015 edited
NP: UP (2009) - Michael Giacchino
First Listen. Playful, jazzy and melodic. Fun. Is it Ragtime? Something like that. I need to see the film now.
But I would have given the Oscar to Avatar ...
VolkerBach's music is vibrant and inspired. -
- CommentTimeApr 9th 2015
Oscars are a crock of shit, so I wouldn't burn too much fuel worrying about It. -
- CommentTimeApr 9th 2015
Far From the Madding Crowd - Craig Armstrong
Well, I didn't know Armstrong could do this sort of thing. Some Vaughan Williams inspiration here (same as JNH in some of his Shyamalan scores), at times a hint of Rachel Portman. Gorgeous! -
- CommentTimeApr 9th 2015
PawelStroinski wrote
I'd argue that the first score to involve ostinati in action scoring more was actually King Arthur
An ostinato is essentially a repeated idea, isn't it? With the rest of the cue gradually building over it? Isn't this basically what Jerry Goldsmith's action music was, all the way from the 60s onwards? Or am I missing something? (Maybe you meant King Arthur was Zimmer's first one, not the first one.) -
- CommentTimeApr 9th 2015 edited
Southall wrote
PawelStroinski wrote
I'd argue that the first score to involve ostinati in action scoring more was actually King Arthur
An ostinato is essentially a repeated idea, isn't it? With the rest of the cue gradually building over it? Isn't this basically what Jerry Goldsmith's action music was, all the way from the 60s onwards? Or am I missing something? (Maybe you meant King Arthur was Zimmer's first one, not the first one.)
Even 10 years ago, King Arthur was just another step along a path that Zimmmer and friends had been trodding since the early 90s in their quest to take over the world for Lord Ostinato.
When I bought that score in 2004 I did not think, "oh, this is a cool new musical device." I thought, "cool, more of this fun musical device that Zimmer and friends like to use a lot". One could definitely say it was the first modern Zimmer-style score to be structure around ostinati that extensively, to be sure.I love you all. Never change. Well, unless you want to! -
- CommentTimeApr 9th 2015
An ostinato (basically just a repeating figure or anything) has existed since the beginning of music itself. No big deal. You have to look at more elements to narrow a sound down. At least 2-3 more. And of course also describe HOW the particular ostinato is 'mixed' against other elements or how prominent it is in the composition.I am extremely serious. -
- CommentTimeApr 9th 2015
I always wonder if I'm missing the point when people talk about ostinato-based music as if John Powell invented it and got further confused by Pawel's comment about King Arthur (though like I said, maybe he meant something other than what I took it to mean). -
- CommentTimeApr 9th 2015 edited
Southall wrote
I always wonder if I'm missing the point when people talk about ostinato-based music as if John Powell invented it and got further confused by Pawel's comment about King Arthur (though like I said, maybe he meant something other than what I took it to mean).
I have absolutely no idea how or why KING ARTHUR is being mentioned here. It has no bearing on anything whatsoever other than being part of a particular 90's Zimmer sound (ripe with power anthems too!).
When describing the "Bourne riff", you have to say a lot more than just 'ostinato-based' to cover what it's about -- which is exactly why I prefer the word 'riff'.I am extremely serious. -
- CommentTimeApr 9th 2015
Ostinati, vamps, riffs, loops, arpeggios ... it's been part of music since the beginning of time.Bach's music is vibrant and inspired. -
- CommentTimeApr 9th 2015
Mmmmm... vamps -
- CommentTimeApr 9th 2015
vampires?I am extremely serious. -
- CommentTimeApr 9th 2015
James Hornerhost and executive producer of THE CINEMATIC SOUND RADIO PODCAST | www.cinematicsound.net | www.facebook.com/cinematicsound | I HAVE TINNITUS! -
- CommentTimeApr 10th 2015
Thor wrote
Southall wrote
I always wonder if I'm missing the point when people talk about ostinato-based music as if John Powell invented it and got further confused by Pawel's comment about King Arthur (though like I said, maybe he meant something other than what I took it to mean).
I have absolutely no idea how or why KING ARTHUR is being mentioned here. It has no bearing on anything whatsoever other than being part of a particular 90's Zimmer sound (ripe with power anthems too!).
When describing the "Bourne riff", you have to say a lot more than just 'ostinato-based' to cover what it's about -- which is exactly why I prefer the word 'riff'.
In 2004 when King Arthur came out, there had never been another action/adventure score that had ostinati woven so deeply into its DNA. That's why it's relevant. I mean, I only went to the trouble to figure out the meaning of the word because I wanted to know what that cool musical device that King Arthur used was. It's an enormous milestone in the history of modern film scoring and the ostinato revolution thereof, especially to someone who came into the fandom through the MV/RC "gateway drug". Now, I'm rather sick of ostinati in general unless they're really well done and unique, but I don't think there's any denying the importance of King Arthur in a discussion of ostinati in modern film music.I love you all. Never change. Well, unless you want to! -
- CommentTimeApr 10th 2015
I feel like I've entered another universe. -
- CommentTimeApr 10th 2015
Am I just imagining all the Goldsmith ostinato action music? Miklos Rozsa's!? There were probably thousands of ostinato-based action scores before King Arthur. Certainly hundreds. -
- CommentAuthorTimmer
- CommentTimeApr 10th 2015
One of my favourite uses of Ostinato....
CRAZY TOM
I'll take this over Zimmer's trite usage.On Friday I ate a lot of dust and appeared orange near the end of the day ~ Bregt -
- CommentTimeApr 10th 2015
My technical knowledge ends here, but I can say that to my brain, that usage of an ostinato that you posted is a completely separate technique from the one that Powell, Zimmer etc popularized in the early 2000s. I'm not sure how one would define and categorize the different usages. But the exploding popularity of that specific type of ostinato since the early 2000s implies that it's not just us crazy overanalyzers who see the Zimmer/Powell ostinato as a distinct and important phenomenon. It's the directors and producers and marketers. We all know there's a specific "sound" that most modern moviemakers are looking for in their scoring, which they consider to be "cool", and the specific type of ostinato that Zimmer and Powell pioneered in the early 2000s is somewhere very close to the heart of that sound. There's been even further evolution since then (TDK, Tron Legacy etc were game-changers by lowering the melodic complexity necessary to achieve "the sound" even further) but the early 2000s were when it began, and Powell's work on Bourne Identity was the unintentional prototypical blueprint for the last 13 years and counting of Hollywood's new understanding of what "cool" music is.I love you all. Never change. Well, unless you want to! -
- CommentTimeApr 10th 2015
Southall wrote
Far From the Madding Crowd - Craig Armstrong
Well, I didn't know Armstrong could do this sort of thing. Some Vaughan Williams inspiration here (same as JNH in some of his Shyamalan scores), at times a hint of Rachel Portman. Gorgeous!
I'm so looking forward to a traditional romantic score from Craig. The album seems like it's full of short tracks, which can be disappointing. Do you have a promo, because it's not released until the 28th though. -
- CommentTimeApr 10th 2015 edited
It's nice that you have such a strong personal connection to KING ARTHUR, Scribe, but I think you're over-estimating its importance -- both in film music and Zimmer's career. If it had been so important as you suggest, more people would hail it as a reference point. At most, it -- too -- bears some BOURNE influence here and there.
That being said, I agree with you that the 'Bourne riff' is a very different type of ostinato-driven music than previous versions, like Goldsmith's or even Philipp Glass'.
OK, let's be more specific.
First of all, the paradigm here is 'contemporary action movies'. That is important to stress. It is only within this genre or paradigm that the sound/change occurs (even if it's been adopted elsewhere too over the years). The setting is often more realistic, thus requiring a sound that is less 'overt'. As such, Powell did this:
* A 4/4 ground bass
* A 16th note "supra" ostinato on strings, fluctuating between a chord or two or three.
* Fragments of a melody at some point, almost with a Middle-Eastern quality (lots of quarter tones)
Hence it's a riff more than a beat. Here it is in BOURNE IDENTITY (John Powell, 2002) from 1:07 onwards:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VkNA1ZErJeI
And here's another example from HITMAN (Geoff Zanelli, 2007), at 0:50:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cCsBUcvaPn4I am extremely serious. -
- CommentTimeApr 10th 2015
Thanks for those Civilization playlists. I'll try them out! -
- CommentTimeApr 10th 2015
NP: SOMEWHERE IN TIME (John Barry)
Gorgeous!I am extremely serious. -
- CommentTimeApr 10th 2015
Thor wrote
NP: SOMEWHERE IN TIME (John Barry)
Gorgeous!
Which version are you listening to: the OST or the re-recording? Both have a lot to offer.The views expressed in this post are entirely my own and do not reflect the opinions of maintitles.net, or for that matter, anyone else. http://www.racksandtags.com/falkirkbairn -
- CommentTimeApr 10th 2015 edited
Thor wrote
It's nice that you have such a strong personal connection to KING ARTHUR, Scribe, but I think you're over-estimating its importance -- both in film music and Zimmer's career. If it had been so important as you suggest, more people would hail it as a reference point. At most, it -- too -- bears some BOURNE influence here and there.
Pawel was the one who brought it up and gave it an even greater importance than I did. And I never attempted to base any of my statements off of any personal connection I may or may not have to the score. You are developing a frustrating tendency to write off anything I say as "due to a personal connection" instead of discussing what I am actually saying. "Everything you say about McKenzie not being pastiche is wrong because you like McKenzie"
First of all, the paradigm here is 'contemporary action movies'. That is important to stress. It is only within this genre or paradigm that the sound/change occurs (even if it's been adopted elsewhere too over the years).
I feel this is an oversimplification. Ostinati are everywhere now. They're an all-consuming virus. You'd have to have an extremely broad definition of "action movie" to make this statement work. Is Tron Legacy a "contemporary action movie"?
Or are you saying Powell's device is a distinct phenomenon (the King Arthur / Da Vinci Code / Batman trilogy / TRON Legacy / etc development of that type of ostinato)? I could buy that. It's just that I've always lumped that device in with Powell's device when I look at the development of film music trends over the past 15 years.
I need to stop being a caffeine addictI love you all. Never change. Well, unless you want to! -
- CommentTimeApr 10th 2015
FalkirkBairn wrote
Thor wrote
NP: SOMEWHERE IN TIME (John Barry)
Gorgeous!
Which version are you listening to: the OST or the re-recording? Both have a lot to offer.
The old Varese album. I don't know if that's the OST or the REC.I am extremely serious. -
- CommentAuthorPawelStroinski
- CommentTimeApr 10th 2015
Southall wrote
PawelStroinski wrote
I'd argue that the first score to involve ostinati in action scoring more was actually King Arthur
An ostinato is essentially a repeated idea, isn't it? With the rest of the cue gradually building over it? Isn't this basically what Jerry Goldsmith's action music was, all the way from the 60s onwards? Or am I missing something? (Maybe you meant King Arthur was Zimmer's first one, not the first one.)
Yes, I meant Hans, though while Goldsmith music is based on repeated ideas, I wouldn't call it as ostinato-based as I would call, say, Bernard Herrmann's approach. The motifs are somehow a bit too complex for me to call them an ostinato, though I could be wrong here and I'll happily stand corrected.
Of course Herrmann was all about ostinati quite often, so I'd never say that it was the first ostinato score ever.http://www.filmmusic.pl - Polish Film Music Review Website