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ALEXANDRE DESPLAT
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- CommentAuthorSouthall
- CommentTimeFeb 5th 2009
Ralph Kruhm wrote
Southall wrote
One of the things the recent posts illustrate is that there is a huge gap between the perception that Star Wars was this great influence which changed all of film music, and the reality that actually barely anyone else has written anything like it since.
It's GREAT. Absolutely GREAT! But this theory that we suddenly saw an end to the bad ways of film music before and turned on to great film music afterwards is a weird one for me. The year before Star Wars, the Oscar was won by The Omen; the year after, it was won by Midnight Express.
Well, of course SW didn´t stop all that came before, and didn´t start all that came after. But its role in film music is undisputed, I think.
It's role as a great score is undisputed, but I would certainly consider disputing whether it has any role other than that. Like I said, nobody's particularly written a score like it since. Battle Beyond the Stars is much more Goldsmithian than anything else, Krull and Star Trek II are nothing like it; Battlestar Galactica and Masters of the Universe verge on rip-off territory, but that's more a case of the filmmakers being influenced by Star Wars and demanding similar music than anything else, I'd have thought. It's not influential the way that Man with the Golden Arm or The Magnificent Seven or (gulp) Titanic and Gladiator have been. Those things caused a sea change in the way movies were scored. -
- CommentAuthorRalph Kruhm
- CommentTimeFeb 5th 2009
Hm... I have to think about that. -
- CommentAuthorSouthall
- CommentTimeFeb 5th 2009
So will I, after Franz or Erik or Martijn or someone else with more brains than me points out the big hole in my argument. -
- CommentAuthorErik Woods
- CommentTimeFeb 6th 2009 edited
What Star Wars did was make the grand, old school Hollywood film score acceptable again yet made it sound a bit more modern in a distinct John Williams style. Sure, symphonic scores were still being written in the 1960's and 1970's but they weren't as relevant as they were in the Golden Age. Film scores were far more experimental and the search for the next pop hit was more important than the symphonic film score. Just look at what happened with Torn Curtain. However, after 1977 there was a boom in the grand old school thematic over the top Hollywood film score and most people would say it was because of John Williams and Star Wars. After 1977 the big hollywood blockbuster now needed a big John Williams styled symphonic film score.
-Erik-host and executive producer of THE CINEMATIC SOUND RADIO PODCAST | www.cinematicsound.net | www.facebook.com/cinematicsound | I HAVE TINNITUS! -
- CommentAuthorfranz_conrad
- CommentTimeFeb 6th 2009 edited
Southall wrote
Ralph Kruhm wrote
Southall wrote
One of the things the recent posts illustrate is that there is a huge gap between the perception that Star Wars was this great influence which changed all of film music, and the reality that actually barely anyone else has written anything like it since.
It's GREAT. Absolutely GREAT! But this theory that we suddenly saw an end to the bad ways of film music before and turned on to great film music afterwards is a weird one for me. The year before Star Wars, the Oscar was won by The Omen; the year after, it was won by Midnight Express.
Well, of course SW didn´t stop all that came before, and didn´t start all that came after. But its role in film music is undisputed, I think.
It's role as a great score is undisputed, but I would certainly consider disputing whether it has any role other than that. Like I said, nobody's particularly written a score like it since. Battle Beyond the Stars is much more Goldsmithian than anything else, Krull and Star Trek II are nothing like it; Battlestar Galactica and Masters of the Universe verge on rip-off territory, but that's more a case of the filmmakers being influenced by Star Wars and demanding similar music than anything else, I'd have thought. It's not influential the way that Man with the Golden Arm or The Magnificent Seven or (gulp) Titanic and Gladiator have been. Those things caused a sea change in the way movies were scored.
I think the big thing about SW as a score of influence was the symphonic thing, and showing popular support among moviegoers for a film that used that style. (Edit - which Martijn and Erik both say.)
Because the other main influence was very dependent on the type of film STAR WARS was, a film dependent on simple types more than many of the big films of that era. The score, reflecting this type of story, could indulge in traditional heroic scoring that hadn't had a lot of place in the relatively complicated films of the late 60s/70s. The good guy could be as good as Luke's theme; the woman, as demure and feminine as Leia's theme; the villains, down in the low strings/brass end. And the success of STAR WARS was the success of that style of story, which you see influencing things as diverse as Michael Kamen's ROBIN HOOD (even if the idiom is a bit more popular) and (in a perverse way) Basil Poledouris's FLESH AND BLOOD. Anywhere where traditional heroics needed musical reinforcement, you have to wonder whether the success of STAR WARS (the film, and therefore the music) made that possible. (Mind you, the mood was ripe for it, if it hadn't been STAR WARS, surely someone would have tapped the nerve within a few years of it? Or would ST:TMP have killed the genre financially in the absence of a successful SW?)
An interesting point, but unrelated: not every great score influences others. We're still waiting to hear a MATRIX imitation.A butterfly thinks therefore I am -
- CommentAuthorRalph Kruhm
- CommentTimeFeb 6th 2009 edited
Good points, from both of you, to which I absolutely agree.
There is not much to add, beside that I´ll be eternally thankful for the fact that Star Wars just made orchestral scores so cool again that we got a lot less synth scores for SF/Fantasy-movies than before.
Can you imagine The Black Hole with a synth score?
About that Matrix matter: I think what that score did was so iconographic that it can´t be copied without resulting in an immediate Matrix flashback for the audience. I think it would only work in a similar environment, like high-tech SF or Cyberpunk movies. I think Davis really created a new score genre. It´s the Western of the 21st century. -
- CommentAuthorDemetris
- CommentTimeFeb 6th 2009
Steven wrote
Is there a way to quantify what makes a better score than a great score?
It's all subjective, isn't it?Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders. -
- CommentAuthorDemetris
- CommentTimeFeb 6th 2009
franz_conrad wrote
An interesting point, but unrelated: not every great score influences others. We're still waiting to hear a MATRIX imitation.
Maybe because some musical styles are easier to imitate or carry along as influences in your overall style than others?Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders. -
- CommentAuthorDemetris
- CommentTimeFeb 6th 2009
Btw, has anyone noticed that Desplat is the new Zimmer?
(not musically
)Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders. -
- CommentAuthorRalph Kruhm
- CommentTimeFeb 6th 2009
Christodoulides wrote
Steven wrote
Is there a way to quantify what makes a better score than a great score?
It's all subjective, isn't it?
That´s were I had my problems, too. The difference between a REALLY great score and a great score seems to be the level of dispute.
1) undisputed classics --> Ben-Hur, Star Wars --> REALLY great scores (or, as Erik would say, the Unreachables) --> mostly objective
2) less disputed scores --> Signs --> great scores --> less subjective
3) disputed scores --> Whatever --> good or less scores --> very subjective
Okay, that was bullshit, wasn´t it?
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- CommentAuthorDemetris
- CommentTimeFeb 6th 2009 edited
Music, as all kinds of arts, has always been a very subjective area of countless discussions and debates through the eras. Yes, every genre and sub-genre holds what's generally considered and widely accepted as "classics", works that bear undisputed quality and certain characteristic traits which have usually influenced in varying degrees either the genre / sub-genre in its entity, or - in some rare cases, even the whole musical body.
However, despite the diachronic and universal Masterful musical works of Humanity as a whole (Some Renaissance / Polyphony and basically from Baroque 'till the Late Romantic and some 20th century) which are truly works of geniuses and have defined MUSIC as we know it today in every possible way (apart the serialism / atonal / Aleatoric music / electronic music (with its academic, formal meaning, not the dance hits etc) and other modern experimental techniques whose true value will show (or not) after long, long time has passed from now), the rest is highly subjective and it's linked to a specific decade, era and its surrounding temporal, cultural standards ANY literate, experienced and self-respecting lover of the arts and music of ANY genre or sub-genre knows (or should know) this in heart.Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders. -
- CommentAuthorRalph Kruhm
- CommentTimeFeb 6th 2009
Well, I WAS talking about our small group of film music lovers, wasn´t I?
It should be clear that Joe the Plumber would certainly have another taste about music than your average amazonas shaman.
I find it more than acceptable if a small group of individuals with a shared interest like film scoring try to figure out some common criteriae about what makes a score great.
That each person has an individual preference is not disputed. You might remember that I am one of those who constantly refer to the fact that taste is neither wrong nor right, better or worse. If I like Michael Clayton, I don´t have to explain it. -
- CommentAuthorDemetris
- CommentTimeFeb 6th 2009
I know, i haven't contradicted what you say; yet
I am mostly answering to Steven's question.Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders. -
- CommentAuthorRalph Kruhm
- CommentTimeFeb 6th 2009 edited
If you had just quoted him, I wouldn´t have spend half an hour investigating what part of your post was contradicting what I said, and when I couldn´t find it, I obviously made something up from what I thought was not fully comprehendable for me due to language barriers.
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- CommentAuthorfranz_conrad
- CommentTimeFeb 6th 2009
Ralph Kruhm wrote
It should be clear that Joe the Plumber would certainly have another taste about music than your average amazonas shaman.
Does Joe have his own TV show yet?A butterfly thinks therefore I am -
- CommentAuthorRalph Kruhm
- CommentTimeFeb 6th 2009 edited
No idea, but if we germans know him already, it´s about time. ^^ -
- CommentAuthorsdtom
- CommentTimeFeb 6th 2009
I have to look at everything that I listen to differently because of the review process that I go through with at least 100 of them every year. My first listen isn't exactly what it turns out to be as far as how much I enjoy it because if it were many of them would have been deemed awful. And I always attempt to see the film if I possibly can. "The Reader", as an example, really came alive as much as a subdued score can after seeing the film and making notes.
Thomas
listen to more classical music! -
- CommentAuthorAnthony
- CommentTimeMar 10th 2009
CHÉRI
Original Motion Picture Soundtrack
Music Composed by Alexandre Desplat
Michelle Pfeiffer
Performed by London Symphony Orchestra
Set in the luxurious demi-monde of pre-First World War Paris, Chéri is the story of the love affair between the beautiful retired courtesan Léa (Michelle Pfeiffer) and Chéri (Rupert Friend), the son of her old colleague and rival, Madame Peloux (Kathy Bates). Léa has educated the spoilt and callow boy in the ways of love, but after six years Madame Peloux has secretly arranged a marriage between Chéri and Edmée (Felicity Jones), daughter of another rich courtesan. As the inevitable moment of parting approaches, Léa and Chéri try to come to terms with their imminent separation, but the roots of their life of ease and pleasure reach deeper than even they imagine and they begin to understand, too late, how much they mean to one another. CHÉRI is the latest film from Oscar-nominated director Stephen Frears (The Queen, The Grifters).
The sumptuous score is by Oscar nominee, Alexandre Desplat.
CHÉRI will begin an International rollout across Europe this April, and will arrive in U.S. theatres this June.
Varèse Sarabande Catalog #: 302 066 961 2
Release Date: 06/09/09
We're getting a new Desplat every month it seems. Will the guy ever take a break?!
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- CommentAuthorsdtom
- CommentTimeMar 10th 2009
He appears to be obsessed with working like Steiner and Victor Young.listen to more classical music! -
- CommentAuthorDemetris
- CommentTimeMar 10th 2009 edited
Anyone who works a lot is a Steiner / Victor Young work-maniac?Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders. -
- CommentAuthorTimmer
- CommentTimeMar 10th 2009
Christodoulides wrote
Anyone who works a lot is a Steiner / Victor Young work-maniac?
As long as the scores don't lessen in quality.On Friday I ate a lot of dust and appeared orange near the end of the day ~ Bregt -
- CommentAuthorDemetris
- CommentTimeMar 20th 2009
CHÉRI
SOUND CLIPS
http://www.colosseum.de/product_info.ph … Ch-ri.htmlLove Maintitles. It's full of Wanders. -
- CommentAuthorfranz_conrad
- CommentTimeMar 24th 2009
Varese is also releasing his score to COCO AVANT CHANEL, starring Audrey Tatou, in a couple of months. This is the year for scoring actress vehicles for Desplat, it seems. (Since CHERI is a Michelle Pfeiffer vehicle, and JULIE/JULIA is a Nora Ephron film with Meryl Streep and Amy Adams.)A butterfly thinks therefore I am -
- CommentAuthorDemetris
- CommentTimeMar 24th 2009
Nice additions!Love Maintitles. It's full of Wanders. -
- CommentAuthorAnthony
- CommentTimeMar 24th 2009
Another Desplat...
Does this guy know the concept of a holiday?
COCO AVANT CHANEL
Original Motion Picture Soundtrack
Music Composed by Alexandre Desplat
Performed by The London Symphony Orchestra
Audrey Tautou (Amelie, The Da Vinci Code) stars as legendary fashion designer Coco Chanel in this biopic penned by director Anne Fontaine and screenwriter Camille Fontaine in collaboration with Christopher Hampton. Based on the Chanel biography L’Irreguliere (The Nonconformist) by author Edmonde Charles-Roux, Coco Avant Chanel features dresses from the Chanel collection. House of Chanel art director Karl Lagerfeld supervised the creation of accessories and costumes.
The sumptuous and beautifully tailored score for the film was composed by Alexandre Desplat (The Curious Case of Benjamin Button) and performed by The London Symphony Orchestra.
Warner Bros. will begin an international rollout of Coco Avant Chanel in France on April 22. Sony Classics will distribute in America.
Varèse Sarabande Catalog #: 302 066 968 2
European Release Date: 04/09
US iTunes release date: 4/21/09 -
- CommentAuthorBregt
- CommentTimeMar 24th 2009
Audrey?
Kazoo -
- CommentAuthorAnthony
- CommentTimeMar 24th 2009
Koko?
Oh wait
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- CommentAuthorDemetris
- CommentTimeMar 24th 2009
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_EuFQwtxwhtw/S … drey-1.jpgLove Maintitles. It's full of Wanders. -
- CommentAuthorBasilB
- CommentTimeMar 31st 2009
Coco Avant Chanel:
Track Listing, Cover and Track Samples over at www.colosseum.de
http://www.colosseum.de/product_info.ph … hanel.html
Orderd!
All best -
- CommentAuthorsdtom
- CommentTimeApr 1st 2009
I have to relate Victor Young to my life except at the end. Victor died of a stroke, as many do who have them at 56. We both worked 7 days a week 10-12 hours a day with little time off and this was a key reason for having the stroke.listen to more classical music!
